Suzuki Swift T3 conversion - engine no start

[fixkick]

Hmm. it seems that a 1991 Turbo Sprint does not have ODB1 or even a 12 pin ALDL connector, only the CEL and a Diagnostic fuse socket.
This must have been one of the reasons these cars were never sold in the USA, as Canadian ODB standards may have been less stringent.
It looks like the wiring harness will need to be re-verified wire by wire. Later on, I may get an inexpensive handheld oscilloscope as it seems to be a small investment to improve our understanding of electrical faults for cars of this era.

see all those bits. good bad or ugly
it does have a connector, with 1 pin, that pin is just a bidirectional serial data pin, near TTL232 in operation.
the tech1 one needs and adapter to fit yours and get access to 2 pin ,ground and SD, SD is serial data, same as the ASDL (assembly line, data links have)
make sure any scope has 10:1 probe, and scope inputs are not 5v, but 60 or more, of the scope blows up.
the only one that seems to work now is this, the $100 price point
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40...r&_sacat=0

http://www.jeepdied.com/electrics.html#DSO


later Ill try to read your FSM book, all those TIF files.
and find the ECU pages that shows all pins , all names on one page.
many of the pages are over simplified, just basics, we need real schematics, to work problems like this.

back later....

[fixkick]

the last drawing gif , huge, showing all wires, in car on one page, wow, what a monster that it.
the ECU has many inputs
it shows MAF, "air flow meter " of some kind, many 1991 have a switch there that must be open or closed cranking or the ECU refuses to spark or fuel or both.
and that idle switch, it too , is monitored.
shows no crank sensor, no CKP
only distrib. CMP, Just like all our 91s have,
and many devices on the Ignition spark coil. many.
the "obd1" like device is called the monitor coupler , we had them on GM cars in 1980 way before suz, dreamed of them.
lacking a scope or scan tool, is very limiting, but in any case, one would have check the CMP, and all ECU pins, and the many parts seen on the distributor and spark coil.
what if you put in a whole new harness and it fails to make spark.???? would not that be a horror?
what we do is measure every pin in the ecu, using a meter and on the dynamic pins a scope.
in the old days, we used a thing called a breakout box. to make this easier.
keep in mind nobody (cept some long retired Japaneese eng. in Japan (mitsubishi") knows what this firmware does. only he knows.
You can be sure the FSM only skims over this... as is par.
The fact is we dont know what pins dead will kill spark (sure cmp) but what others, its a Turbo and they have more rules on Turbos,
the rules prevent, warranty claims, etc.
oil switch? , comes to mind, MAF switch, idle switch,park switch, failure., I have no idea, but validating all ECU pins wins this battle.
we dont know , so we check them all, they have a page for that, . see ours, here, on last link below, see how that works.
Some older ECU dont report all dead inputs... this too, can send tech on wild goose chase,,, what if cmp is dead. as one example.
and ECU mute on that....

as seen here. see the monitor couple , one pin is SD, i bet. serial data. the fsm you have will cover this.




last resort, see this?

http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/ECU-8v.html

see page 1 2,3,4 there, that is ecu pins tests. out of fsm
but on some cars the CMP is a non hall sensor and must use a scope. (its faraday coil and if the shields are bad the signals dont make it to mama, ECU)
the non hall, is very tiny signals and coax, line around 2 wires, as yours shows.
Not saying i know what sensors your car has, ive not looked at all sensor in your book, yet.

yes, in Canada, they sold gray market cars back then, up there, they imported them. even JDM cars, lacking many smog parts,
but most have the SD pin.

[fixkick]

with a scope,. we check all pins in the ignitor first. (if the center HV tower pin is dead, no spark at coil, is this true??????)
if the center IG coil pin is ok then the distrib is time wrong, see?
if the center is dead, or weak, then we check the ingitor pins, (and if the condensor is missing,or not grounded , really all grounds here must be good.)
if the input to the ignitor is dead. yellow and org. (if one is dead , other will be)
then the ECU has cut spark.
if the ECU cuts spark we check all pins on the ECU, starting at CMP, if CMP is a Faraday (passive sensor lacking Transistors inside) then we must use a scope.
if the CMP is hall, even a analog meter works and works best, it wags, 0v, 5v,0v 5v as you crank.
if the CMP is Faraday, then you must get those weak signals to the ECU as small as 0.5v, 500mV tiny ... slower the crankshaft moves the weak they are. Unlike HALL.
that is how all cars work. lacking a scan tool
the scan tool would show RPM dead. dead as a door nail. and no spark (for example)

im sure you know all that, just talking how to attack it lacking real tools...... scanner, scope. etc.....

if the cmp sigs look ok, (ignitor dead) then we must read all pins on the ECU, sorry, but all computers work like that, GIGO , garbage in , garbage out.
and no opens source software to read , and to see, OMG, this bugger, cuts spark for XXX and YYY and ZZZ

[fixkick]

the coil primary (minus lug) has 100v spikes on it, and 5v scopes blow up, with those.
the linked scope above is one if the first ever to have protective inputs, this cheap.

your car uses ground in ways that is pure evil. btw
using body ground is ok with silly tunsten lamps. but not the ECU.
on ours only the ecu , noise clamps in the ECU use body ground.
the other grounds are all black wire run. so that ECU has its own ground system, for signals.
on a stock suz, car, there are many ground stap,s that can not be missing.
5 or more....
seen here. on our.

as an example of what must work ground wise

sees this G numbers, none can be bad, that say ECU.
http://www.fixkick.com/Good_Bad_Ugly/com...lures.html

[fixkick]

just and example there.
yours has its own see of critical grounds, all suz , bodys are different. and engines. and turbo.

[fixkick]

that DRAWING above, gif, marked condenser is just a real noise suppressor for coil plus, keeps coil noise out of the cars power feed, so radio dont click madly
Condensor = capacitor, in Automotive world.
the real IGN condenser , as in the ringing resonant bell function, called tank circuit in radio electronics, (im a HAM operator) must be present
this real condenser (the bell ringer) is in the named suppressor or the ignitor. (suz. drawings dont tell)
the real condensor (bell ringer) causes the coil primary to resonate with the condensor, forming a tank circuit (parallel tank,)

this fact makes spark longer lasting as it fires, and then rings out, dampens out. bang, ring, bank ring.
just like a bell does, hit,
now imagine stuffing sheets or blankets in your bell, hit it and it just goes clank. (weak spark) that is why I asked you to test the HV tower, conn,,
so i can see what the HV does ALL BY ITS SELF.??????????
if it is a HV spike only, and is weak-spark, the condensor can be bad, or missing or bad grounds to it. (where ever IT may hide or be)

here is what condensor does on a 1929 ford coil, see this puppy ring, and make HUGE park.
http://www.jeepdied.com/scope%20views/vi...mp4_2.html

see that even 1929 parts can make huge spark, poof.

[fixkick]

this is why I start at the coil tower first.
dead, weak, strong, intermittent. are all clues, hard clues.... to know.
HV spark at the coil top, are all #1 first tests. using good new 1 spark wire and a spark plug new, gapped at 28 thou. or 0.7mm

[fixkick]

at HV tower post.(ign coil)
if intermittent, it can be on the ignitor side (lots of ways)
or the cmp is bad. (signal bad for many reasons)
only scope finds this easy, at CMp and at ignitor pins.
trusting the ECU to tell you may fail. 41s only means spark is bad at ignitor. but could be a bad CMP if the ECU is that dumb to report spark bad, and not tell you, oh btw the cmp is dead. code 42
some may do that. seen it on other cars.

[t3tom]

Wow. lots of information to process.

The distributor on the T3 is a Hall effect type.

None of the 28 pins used in the T3 ECU is for serial data. The car has a 4 pin Monitor Coupler. Connecting the pins B & C enable Diagnostic Mode by connecting a ground path to the diagnostic request signal wire from the ECU and the CEL light flashes any codes. The other 2 pins go to the DNL lamp located in the instrument cluster and the Test Switch Signal on the ECU. The T3 does not have the extra Duty Output Terminal or the Diagnostic Output Terminal of later cars. So this means no serial data access from the factory is available without finding the serial pin inside the ECU I guess..

We will try to check for spark at the coil next, as well as check whether the CMP is working.

I have found a portable handheld oscilloscope similar to the input voltage rating spec you recommended. (Unfortunately ebay does not sell the one you suggested anymore). The one I am considering has an x10 probe rated at 400DCVmax. (single channel).
http://www.seeedstudio.com/wiki/DSO_Nano_v3

[fixkick]

Wow. lots of information to process.

The distributor on the T3 is a Hall effect type.

None of the 28 pins used in the T3 ECU is for serial data. The car has a 4 pin Monitor Coupler. Connecting the pins B & C enable Diagnostic Mode by connecting a ground path to the diagnostic request signal wire from the ECU and the CEL light flashes any codes. The other 2 pins go to the DNL lamp located in the instrument cluster and the Test Switch Signal on the ECU. The T3 does not have the extra Duty Output Terminal or the Diagnostic Output Terminal of later cars. So this means no serial data access from the factory is available without finding the serial pin inside the ECU I guess..

We will try to check for spark at the coil next, as well as check whether the CMP is working.

I have found a portable handheld oscilloscope similar to the input voltage rating spec you recommended. (Unfortunately ebay does not sell the one you suggested anymore). The one I am considering has an x10 probe rated at 400DCVmax. (single channel).
http://www.seeedstudio.com/wiki/DSO_Nano_v3

bad news that, zero comms. never seen one, before, fore sure dont exist in usa...why make digital ECU and cant comm to it. amazing. (and on a turbo no less....)
thanks for sharing that bit of news.

the coil test is always first , what if the distributor can distribute spark correctly (lots of reasons there) but is first. so we can go in the correct direction.
ok seed, i have lots of their stuff
10v scope with 10:1 probe its 100v , and scope is protected to 80v (direct conn)
ok, seems ok 200khz band width, should be ok, for most car PWM sigs.

ok good luck , happy hunting.