2.3 DOHC motor - correct operating temp

[thebanjoman]

LAST CVS LOOKS GOOD, AT KEY OFF 0RPM IS SEE THE BLOCK heat soaked up to 255F , that is super hot.   Hot soak temp.
the EFI runs in code 2 , full time expected, so the 02 is happy at , mid point, of its range.  all good... no lean that.
I seen no problems in the data just  very hot ECT sensor.   and the OBD voltage glitches to 9v, line 259 /262 there very odd, beside key off at line 426.
at 39.2 load on engine looks perfect, but hot.

 
 OK,  so if its not running lean that may kick up the temps, what could it be?

 Coolant flow??   Could I have air in the system?  I used an 'air lift' system when filling coolant.

 I haven't put on the stant thermostat, I will do that this weekend. and will repeat the process.

 Where do I go from here??

[fixkick]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

[thebanjoman]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

[thebanjoman]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

  This weekend I am going to put in the new thermostat,   While I am at it since the coolant will be out I will take apart at the heater core hose connections and make 100% sure there is no obstruction or low flow of pipe 22 and the heater core itself (using your pic) since coolant comes from the back of the engine, through the heater core to the thermostat housing.  

I know we discussed that if there was obstruction the thermostat would surge but I am not experiencing this.

While I have the thermostat out I will take off the serpentine belt and see if I feel any play i the waterpump and put my fingers in and check all the impeller
blades.  

What I am doing is probably 'make work' but it will be piece of mind to me knowing that there isn't any obstruction.
  

[thebanjoman]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

  This weekend I am going to put in the new thermostat,   While I am at it since the coolant will be out I will take apart at the heater core hose connections and make 100% sure there is no obstruction or low flow of pipe 22 and the heater core itself (using your pic) since coolant comes from the back of the engine, through the heater core to the thermostat housing.  

I know we discussed that if there was obstruction the thermostat would surge but I am not experiencing this.

While I have the thermostat out I will take off the serpentine belt and see if I feel any play i the waterpump and put my fingers in and check all the impeller
blades.  

What I am doing is probably 'make work' but it will be piece of mind to me knowing that there isn't any obstruction.
  

 I spent some time today just looking over the system as a whole,    It was too hot in the shop today for me to want to pull apart the cooling system.

 Still same temps at idle. close to 240 .   Looking at the above diagram Coolant leaves the engine across the ECT and into the heater core, leaves the heater core into Pipe 22 and then onto the thermostat housing.

 I turned on the heat cabin heat with the thermometer with heat on low and the temp at the vent only got to 120.     

 If the heater core was operating properly, wouldn't we expect to see the temps out of the vent higher?   

 Could part of this temp management be because the heater core is blocked?      

 I am getting coolant to the wax pellet leaving pipe 22.

 Even though I used an air lift system to put coolant in I thought I heard a gurgling sound in the cab so there still might be air in the system.

 I forgot to also tell you that this Sport has a 2" body lift so the heater core is higher than what it is stock.  Could there still be air in it?

  I could also be totally full of SHI* at this point to, not knowing what I am doing.

[thebanjoman]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

  This weekend I am going to put in the new thermostat,   While I am at it since the coolant will be out I will take apart at the heater core hose connections and make 100% sure there is no obstruction or low flow of pipe 22 and the heater core itself (using your pic) since coolant comes from the back of the engine, through the heater core to the thermostat housing.  

I know we discussed that if there was obstruction the thermostat would surge but I am not experiencing this.

While I have the thermostat out I will take off the serpentine belt and see if I feel any play i the waterpump and put my fingers in and check all the impeller
blades.  

What I am doing is probably 'make work' but it will be piece of mind to me knowing that there isn't any obstruction.
  

 I spent some time today just looking over the system as a whole,    It was too hot in the shop today for me to want to pull apart the cooling system.

 Still same temps at idle. close to 240 .   Looking at the above diagram Coolant leaves the engine across the ECT and into the heater core, leaves the heater core into Pipe 22 and then onto the thermostat housing.

 I turned on the heat cabin heat with the thermometer with heat on low and the temp at the vent only got to 120.     

 If the heater core was operating properly, wouldn't we expect to see the temps out of the vent higher?   

 Could part of this temp management be because the heater core is blocked?      

 I am getting coolant to the wax pellet leaving pipe 22.

 Even though I used an air lift system to put coolant in I thought I heard a gurgling sound in the cab so there still might be air in the system.

 I forgot to also tell you that this Sport has a 2" body lift so the heater core is higher than what it is stock.  Could there still be air in it?

  I could also be totally full of SHI* at this point to, not knowing what I am doing.

  Back flushing the heater core was a big bust..  It was in very good condition I got very little rust out of it.

  At least I know that it's not plugged..  I didn't get a chance to change the thermostat yet.   That will probably be next weekend.

[fixkick]

now lets look at heat.  (engine to coolant)
see this great drawing graph...
in closed loop , the black vertical line is at stoich,
then if fuel goes lean to the right a bit, efficiency  rises , heat the the water jackets goes DOWN as the red line peaks,.
The reason we use Stoich is for low smog, not max HP see on gray cloud point.
Unless you go super lean (and felt in the seat of the pants) it will not run hotter coolant.
yes lean can burn exhaust valves tips. as the do get hotter, but not the water jackets. (this lean hot combustion lasts for shorter time, and does not expose the cylinder walls with more heat but less (yes complex that) that is why late timing puts  too much flame front on the walls, of the cylinder. bad for the cooling system that.

The leaning out, same fuel used (volume) makes more HP, and wastes less heat, until the cold air (oxygen) is so great the fuel is heating mostly air, and efficiency drops.
so lean only wastes heat if way too lean. waste heat is the inverse of the red line here.
not to mention once too lean the spark can not fire off the lean mix and it misfires.




I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant.  in fact a tad lean is less heat to the coolant.
misfire can be a cold slug of air.
or way too late to spark fire and then dumps lots of heat the the cylinder walls. just like late timing does. (and HP FALLS off FAST) felt..

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

  This weekend I am going to put in the new thermostat,   While I am at it since the coolant will be out I will take apart at the heater core hose connections and make 100% sure there is no obstruction or low flow of pipe 22 and the heater core itself (using your pic) since coolant comes from the back of the engine, through the heater core to the thermostat housing.  

I know we discussed that if there was obstruction the thermostat would surge but I am not experiencing this.

While I have the thermostat out I will take off the serpentine belt and see if I feel any play i the waterpump and put my fingers in and check all the impeller
blades.  

What I am doing is probably 'make work' but it will be piece of mind to me knowing that there isn't any obstruction.
  

 I spent some time today just looking over the system as a whole,    It was too hot in the shop today for me to want to pull apart the cooling system.

 Still same temps at idle. close to 240 .   Looking at the above diagram Coolant leaves the engine across the ECT and into the heater core, leaves the heater core into Pipe 22 and then onto the thermostat housing.

 I turned on the heat cabin heat with the thermometer with heat on low and the temp at the vent only got to 120.     

 If the heater core was operating properly, wouldn't we expect to see the temps out of the vent higher?   

 Could part of this temp management be because the heater core is blocked?      

 I am getting coolant to the wax pellet leaving pipe 22.

 Even though I used an air lift system to put coolant in I thought I heard a gurgling sound in the cab so there still might be air in the system.

 I forgot to also tell you that this Sport has a 2" body lift so the heater core is higher than what it is stock.  Could there still be air in it?

  I could also be totally full of SHI* at this point to, not knowing what I am doing.

  Back flushing the heater core was a big bust..  It was in very good condition I got very little rust out of it.

  At least I know that it's not plugged..  I didn't get a chance to change the thermostat yet.   That will probably be next weekend.

hello and good morning to you:'
the tube 22 flows all the time if the heater core clogs or owner loop (bypasses a core) the other hose 19 sneak that hot water back to pipe 22. and thermostat will stop hunting.

all we know now is:
themostat is out off control, it is my guess fully open (240f sure would be) , and can never regulate as it must, so sticks open from very hot water hitting it from 22 pipe feed.

1. assuming the thermostat is ok.  that leaves,  
   
2. weak coolant flows,
   
3. rad tubes blocked. Iniside
   
4. pump issues, impeller blade damage of some kind , or belt drive slippage (im sure not you allowing that slip)
   
5. massive air in system
   
6. RAD too small.
   
7. air flowing through the RAD , insufficient.
   
8. or J18 oddness.  (the hose 19 failures,? missing or blocked, 19 must be there, and most flow water all the time. even TB can block it.
   

or we are chasing phantoms. 
The normal car has  ECT below thermostat and flows from very hot top of heat coolant past the stat , and to the top of RAD to be cooled down soon.
so on a G16 car,  the 180F coolant is exit temperatures.
The j18 , sucks in cold water (coolant)  at the thermostat and would cause the thermostat go nuts , if not for the pipe22 actions.

The J18  pump then flows water into the head'/block jackets, and gets hotter, more than180F (as it started at 180f) and then exit the top rear of the head and will be hotter
and the ECT will read wrong or reads exit temps not thermostat temps. . The ECT is  not in the normal place.
the thermostat on this car controls cold water input to the engine, not output like normal cars.
ahh but that is what I see at first blush but am wrong, above (1/2 wrong)
It  thermostat in this car does run off the hot side,  this is the tricky part,

lets call hose 19 the red hot hose, this hose runs coolant at full engine exit hot temps.
that means that very hot temp, sneaks that very hot water back to pipe 22.
pipe 22 then puts this very hot engine exit hot water to the base wax pellet of the thermostat and only this sneaky hot water makes the thermostat, act just like G16 does.
very tricky this. no?

that means the the heater core can cause and illegal water temp drop, with cab blower fully max on.
that hose 19 bypass sneaks hot water back to the thermostat and prevents the cab heater core for dropping said temperatures,  and causing thermostat errors.
make sure all your hose 19 path are good.
or as a test ,one could  loop the heater core hose set,  jump 25 to 26,  this will slam very hot water to the thermostat. (as would be normal)

the sad part is we do not have sensors on the back side of the thermostat to know what is really happening. (180f regulating is correct, nothing else)

if the thermostat is out of control , the Rad is not working.  

the key fact is , that the thermostat does regulate , based on hose 1 heat.
what happens is on say driving fast up a hill the engine makes more heat and dumps this to the water jackets and the thermostat opens more sucking in colder water and preventing  the water temps from rising. (regulation)
if the ECT shows 250f, (saw it) then means , 250f must hit the thermostat WAX , the wax expands and slams open the thermostat poppet, and if the temps dont drop , flow is not good or the RAD is not working.

this is why I wish you can measure all temps on the pump casing,  even try 2 IR GUN some lie.  only point to metal, when too hot engine.
pipe 22 is metal and best place to measure  too is at its end just as it enters pump casing.
cheers ! those are my thoughts , the AM

[fixkick]

point #2 (very close points )
the 12psi rad cap + 50% AF, dictates boil over point, as low as 259F (varies a tad by maker of AF)
but we saw driving 250F hit and that is not good at all, only 9F from boil , not at all.
either hose 19 is missing clogged ,  or the RAD is not doing its job. (but which is it?)

The only way to prove this is to gain some how,  the true temps behind the STAT, in that chamber there where pipe 22 lands.
they (SUZ) didn't make that easy, did they?. The G16 it's  a freebee (ect right there),  J18/23 a real pain.
some IR guns work way better than others. (as does longer period of idling hot, so that all parts can normalize, and be too hot)

but that 250f must land on stat WAX or it will fail.,  this is first. a first first thing, that must happen when at 250F.
if is not at 250f (when ECT IS) , we fix that first.
if is 250F (ect) lands at the STAT wax, then the STAT is 100% open NOW, at 250f and the RAD is failing (means weak flow, of water through it  OR air over it failing)
is this rad new or used,
if used, do the IR gun trick measure each tube, 2inches from tanks, ends.
top and bottom (end to end the tube)  I IR gun each tube an can see up to 50f drop end to end if any tube reads same on both ends the tube is clogged.
there is also a great camera trick for IR photos of the RAD to see cold tubes.  an amazing thing to see, but the hand IR gun can do the same thing just takes 15min work.
if the RAD is new, then no need to check it.
is not air flow, the coolant temps too hot at 50 to 70mph so not fans full blame. 

FLIR camera,  hot tubes are very orange.
dead tubes dark.
normal on this race car,  screens is there.
https://ivytools.files.wordpress.com/201...diator.png

let me see if i can find the bad one.

all the video, is best,  a very bad rad, 10% left.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqOodFvHYDM


Duane is the older fellow here, and is master mech.... and a great speaker ! his library of videos are priceless.

[thebanjoman]

I so appreciate you working with me on this,  so if you're correct and the engine is not overheating the coolant, and we are sure the ECT temps are correct (We are from the tests performed) 

What's next ??

  This weekend I am going to put in the new thermostat,   While I am at it since the coolant will be out I will take apart at the heater core hose connections and make 100% sure there is no obstruction or low flow of pipe 22 and the heater core itself (using your pic) since coolant comes from the back of the engine, through the heater core to the thermostat housing.  

I know we discussed that if there was obstruction the thermostat would surge but I am not experiencing this.

While I have the thermostat out I will take off the serpentine belt and see if I feel any play i the waterpump and put my fingers in and check all the impeller
blades.  

What I am doing is probably 'make work' but it will be piece of mind to me knowing that there isn't any obstruction.
  

 I spent some time today just looking over the system as a whole,    It was too hot in the shop today for me to want to pull apart the cooling system.

 Still same temps at idle. close to 240 .   Looking at the above diagram Coolant leaves the engine across the ECT and into the heater core, leaves the heater core into Pipe 22 and then onto the thermostat housing.

 I turned on the heat cabin heat with the thermometer with heat on low and the temp at the vent only got to 120.     

 If the heater core was operating properly, wouldn't we expect to see the temps out of the vent higher?   

 Could part of this temp management be because the heater core is blocked?      

 I am getting coolant to the wax pellet leaving pipe 22.

 Even though I used an air lift system to put coolant in I thought I heard a gurgling sound in the cab so there still might be air in the system.

 I forgot to also tell you that this Sport has a 2" body lift so the heater core is higher than what it is stock.  Could there still be air in it?

  I could also be totally full of SHI* at this point to, not knowing what I am doing.

  Back flushing the heater core was a big bust..  It was in very good condition I got very little rust out of it.

  At least I know that it's not plugged..  I didn't get a chance to change the thermostat yet.   That will probably be next weekend.

hello and good morning to you:'
the tube 22 flows all the time if the heater core clogs or owner loop (bypasses a core) the other hose 19 sneak that hot water back to pipe 22. and thermostat will stop hunting.

all we know now is:
themostat is out off control, it is my guess fully open (240f sure would be) , and can never regulate as it must, so sticks open from very hot water hitting it from 22 pipe feed.

1. assuming the thermostat is ok.  that leaves,  
   
2. weak coolant flows,
   
3. rad tubes blocked. Iniside
   
4. pump issues, impeller blade damage of some kind , or belt drive slippage (im sure not you allowing that slip)
   
5. massive air in system
   
6. RAD too small.
   
7. air flowing through the RAD , insufficient.
   
8. or J18 oddness.  (the hose 19 failures,? missing or blocked, 19 must be there, and most flow water all the time. even TB can block it.
   

or we are chasing phantoms. 
The normal car has  ECT below thermostat and flows from very hot top of heat coolant past the stat , and to the top of RAD to be cooled down soon.
so on a G16 car,  the 180F coolant is exit temperatures.
The j18 , sucks in cold water (coolant)  at the thermostat and would cause the thermostat go nuts , if not for the pipe22 actions.

The J18  pump then flows water into the head'/block jackets, and gets hotter, more than180F (as it started at 180f) and then exit the top rear of the head and will be hotter
and the ECT will read wrong or reads exit temps not thermostat temps. . The ECT is  not in the normal place.
the thermostat on this car controls cold water input to the engine, not output like normal cars.
ahh but that is what I see at first blush but am wrong, above (1/2 wrong)
It  thermostat in this car does run off the hot side,  this is the tricky part,

lets call hose 19 the red hot hose, this hose runs coolant at full engine exit hot temps.
that means that very hot temp, sneaks that very hot water back to pipe 22.
pipe 22 then puts this very hot engine exit hot water to the base wax pellet of the thermostat and only this sneaky hot water makes the thermostat, act just like G16 does.
very tricky this. no?

that means the the heater core can cause and illegal water temp drop, with cab blower fully max on.
that hose 19 bypass sneaks hot water back to the thermostat and prevents the cab heater core for dropping said temperatures,  and causing thermostat errors.
make sure all your hose 19 path are good.
or as a test ,one could  loop the heater core hose set,  jump 25 to 26,  this will slam very hot water to the thermostat. (as would be normal)

the sad part is we do not have sensors on the back side of the thermostat to know what is really happening. (180f regulating is correct, nothing else)

if the thermostat is out of control , the Rad is not working.  

the key fact is , that the thermostat does regulate , based on hose 1 heat.
what happens is on say driving fast up a hill the engine makes more heat and dumps this to the water jackets and the thermostat opens more sucking in colder water and preventing  the water temps from rising. (regulation)
if the ECT shows 250f, (saw it) then means , 250f must hit the thermostat WAX , the wax expands and slams open the thermostat poppet, and if the temps dont drop , flow is not good or the RAD is not working.

this is why I wish you can measure all temps on the pump casing,  even try 2 IR GUN some lie.  only point to metal, when too hot engine.
pipe 22 is metal and best place to measure  too is at its end just as it enters pump casing.
cheers ! those are my thoughts , the AM

 
[quote pid='11944' dateline='1565007799']
[quote pid='11943' dateline='1564959546']
I'm just going to have to pull the entire external coolant "plumbing" of the engine off and look for any obstructions.  The body lift makes it easier to get to the back of the motor so this shouldn't be too hard. None of the coolant lines look to be swollen or closed off but I will need to check.

I also now believe that the 'air lift' system I used to fill the radiator did not fully get all the air out of the system.  It could be because I didn't use it properly. I followed the directions but I just don't know, it was a new to me tool.   

When I back flushed the heater core only a little bit of crud came out.  The temp output at the heater before I started was around 120.  I put coolant back into the core using my flush lines before reattaching the original coolant lines and then started to get any remaining air out of the system.    I put my spill proof coolant funnel on the radiator, started the vehicle with heat on low and used a floor jack with a 4" block of wood and raised the front of the vehicle as high as I could. I was sure that the radiator was at the highest point of the system.  I did see bubbles leave the system after a few minutes.  After this the heat out of the vent was 155 so it is clearly possible that air was still in the system the entire time. 

More work to do. 


[/quote]

[/quote]

[fixkick]

"I bet you , your engine is not overheating the coolant. " 240 iis bad, but i see 250)  we think now the ECT is prefect and matches J18 ECU perfectly and that we BELIEVE IT.
I said that NOT  too clear, (my bad)
the fuel burn is not overheating the engine,  the spark advance is correct as is fuel mix  so there is no excess heat to the water jackets is what I meant.
and worse heat is up hill with 1000 lbs of bricks on board and 4 fat person seated.
be you cant do that now because the coolant is 250f many times, and 9 PSI from boil over, not good.
what is happening is :
1: thermostat is closing wrongly (pipe22 issues) and must not close for any reason ever that hot (means not holding 180F as all must do (spec stat)
2: coolant  flows are restricted,  (any where , but not the heater and is option that part, sold that why some are.) The FSM stats, "IF OPTED."
3: or rad too small, IDK.

or cant get air, how in the world can air be wrong at 70mph or near, even 50mph, it can't if all cores are empty of BUGS. AC core and RAD main.

what only we can dream is at 150f , can with xray  eyes see if stat is closing or near full open too hot.
we can't do that. sadly. and is KEY to the riddle on any custom car like this.T
There is one extreme fix, like seen on race cars, adding a 2nd real ECT  someway below the thermostat.
a welder could mount boss here, and a new ECT such that it does not hit back side of thermostat wax puck.
one other trick that can fail,  is run car no thermostat at all, best case, is runs frigid. if overheats to 250f the flow is no good and or rad too small. (just short tests as CAT will pissed and like to burn up, and go red hot) a very tricky test, that most folks never do unless a custom car.
the main RAD FLIR cam test or manual with IR gun can also be good idea,parked and super hot engine.
The rear pump housing as spares are not easy to find.