(12-08-2018, 03:54 PM)thebanjoman Wrote: Picked up a fairly rust free 98 Sport Auto from Oklahoma and transported it to Virginia. Some issues.

1. Push button switch installed for starting. Got to fix it properly.

2 Wont stay running when started. Have to feather pedal until thermostat opens up, it eventually stays running but at around 2500 rpms..

3. ODBII port not working, my Torque App on phone won't see it. Have a '97 sport that has to be parted for rusty frame , ODBII worked with it so I know my reader is fine. Works on other vehicles.

Push button is probably because neutral safety switch went bad, more likely than keyswitch but have to test. Have to pull that mess apart and sort out the real issue. shouldn't be too hard. If it is the ignition switch the one out of my 97 should do the trick.

Won't stay running is bigger issue, Looks like parts where 'shotgunned' without diagnosing the real issues. Pick them apart.

ODBII no dome light so have to start checking fuses under the dash and see if thats the reason.

I have a 97 wiring diagram manual. Hopefully it will be close enough and I wont have to find a 98. These are expensive.

The vehicle has one rust spot behind left rear wheel and its just a dirty vehicle but it should be a keeper.

(12-08-2018, 09:44 PM)fixkick Wrote: the odd running can be also
iSC speed control jammed, gummed up
EGR jammed open same reasons but will have no power near idle.
does engine have full power once it hits 180F coolant?
2500 hot? rpm, ISC dead, or ECU in limphome, mode. with full power????
98 ECU is very different, and only works with 98 injectors,for sure.
no scans and dead comm port is not good; others have complained about lack of comms for years, on SPORTS only, and was found there tools did not do all OBD2 com ports as all new tools do.
pin 2 and 10
some tools do only pin 7. comm levels.
a good tool does all 4 ways. (4th is CAN bus , last added)

seen many car with DLC pin 16 wire cut (power) for the owner DIY some accessories, (vast) for stealing power, to worst of all autostarts. or added cruise or added stereo AMPs etc. (hacks)
make sure the DLC hardness wires look ok. at dash lower edge.

yes do hope you hack is TCM neutral safety switch bypass and not worse.

(12-08-2018, 11:00 PM)thebanjoman Wrote:

(12-08-2018, 09:44 PM)fixkick Wrote: the odd running can be also
iSC speed control jammed, gummed up
EGR jammed open same reasons but will have no power near idle.
does engine have full power once it hits 180F coolant?
2500 hot? rpm, ISC dead, or ECU in limphome, mode. with full power????
98 ECU is very different, and only works with 98 injectors,for sure.
no scans and dead comm port is not good; others have complained about lack of comms for years, on SPORTS only, and was found there tools did not do all OBD2 com ports as all new tools do.
pin 2 and 10
some tools do only pin 7. comm levels.
a good tool does all 4 ways. (4th is CAN bus , last added)

seen many car with DLC pin 16 wire cut (power) for the owner DIY some accessories, (vast) for stealing power, to worst of all autostarts. or added cruise or added stereo AMPs etc. (hacks)
make sure the DLC hardness wires look ok. at dash lower edge.

yes do hope you hack is TCM neutral safety switch bypass and not worse.

Thank you, this is AMAZING feedback. I need to get this one in my shop, I'm parting out my 97 and its 18 degrees outside this morning and don't want to be messing with it outside.. Too many projects. '92 Samurai, a 1929 Model A Ford, and the parting out '97, plus the new '98 all in 900 sq foot. Can't sling a dead cat without hitting something.

Know the '98 auto is a bit different with the PCM but its in really good shape for a 20 yr old vehicle. You don't see them like this in the rust belt.

Guy I got it from wasn't much of a mechanic just a parts swapper and not a good diagnoser, I have seen from the parts in the back that he did swap injectors and coil packs and said the previous owner did the switch mess.

So first order of this is to undo the switch mess and try to get ti back to stock and start from there. Your details will certainly help.

This J18 has 240K on it. I have a 73K J23 sitting here that I want to put in it. I know the CCs are greater but it ran perfectly in my '97 with just a long block swap, keeping the rest. It's been done on 5spds alot. Auto shouldn't be too awful hard to make work also.

(12-09-2018, 02:39 AM)fixkick Wrote:

(12-08-2018, 11:00 PM)thebanjoman Wrote:

(12-08-2018, 09:44 PM)fixkick Wrote: the odd running can be also
iSC speed control jammed, gummed up
EGR jammed open same reasons but will have no power near idle.
does engine have full power once it hits 180F coolant?
2500 hot? rpm, ISC dead, or ECU in limphome, mode. with full power????
98 ECU is very different, and only works with 98 injectors,for sure.
no scans and dead comm port is not good; others have complained about lack of comms for years, on SPORTS only, and was found there tools did not do all OBD2 com ports as all new tools do.
pin 2 and 10
some tools do only pin 7. comm levels.
a good tool does all 4 ways. (4th is CAN bus , last added)

seen many car with DLC pin 16 wire cut (power) for the owner DIY some accessories, (vast) for stealing power, to worst of all autostarts. or added cruise or added stereo AMPs etc. (hacks)
make sure the DLC hardness wires look ok. at dash lower edge.

yes do hope you hack is TCM neutral safety switch bypass and not worse.

Thank you, this is AMAZING feedback. I need to get this one in my shop, I'm parting out my 97 and its 18 degrees outside this morning and don't want to be messing with it outside.. Too many projects. '92 Samurai, a 1929 Model A Ford, and the parting out '97, plus the new '98 all in 900 sq foot. Can't sling a dead cat without hitting something.

Know the '98 auto is a bit different with the PCM but its in really good shape for a 20 yr old vehicle. You don't see them like this in the rust belt.

Guy I got it from wasn't much of a mechanic just a parts swapper and not a good diagnoser, I have seen from the parts in the back that he did swap injectors and coil packs and said the previous owner did the switch mess.

So first order of this is to undo the switch mess and try to get ti back to stock and start from there. Your details will certainly help.

This J18 has 240K on it. I have a 73K J23 sitting here that I want to put in it. I know the CCs are greater but it ran perfectly in my '97 with just a long block swap, keeping the rest. It's been done on 5spds alot. Auto shouldn't be too awful hard to make work also.

i want your 29' ford, love them,. my grand-dad had one, was blast to drive . brakes converted first. 3million still on the road, (amazing no>?)
no I agree, the 98 can run, not saying it is a pig only rare good car.
the j20 is stroked 18, and most parts the same but not crank.

I'd buy J18 too if found rust free, nice find for sure.!
The compression good, it will run good soon.
fluids good, brakes good, hoses , belts ok.
engine runs, (yes) cool.
does it reach 180f and hold? (not float tempr. like mad, low .high , low, repeat) if yes this has 2 causes, unique to just this car.
does it have full power even though the idle is fubar.?
my buds j18 we scanned it with 5 of my scan tools only the newest tool worked.
when it scanned we got P0400 EGR and it was dirty, (motor controlled EGR easy to clean)

good luck to you and ouch 18 degr.

(12-09-2018, 05:22 AM)fixkick Wrote: just like the internet (TCP-ip) and lots of ways to connect, up, to communicate (fiber/cable modem,/dialup./DSL, and SAT) once connected it works.

OBD2 is like that in that are are 4 ways to connect,
the connections all 4 use 4 sets of connection pins.
each uses different signal levels and a good too does all 4.
one way to do this is see what pins are wired in the scan too, most old tools are missing some the 4 sets of comm channels.
the worst is the $8 ELM tool that does not do all 4 not even close.

if the 97 ECU talks , why would the 98 not talk?

for now only what matters is not the computer or smart phone
what matters is hardware, if it works on all 4 levels of communications pin sets. only this matters first, if not 4 , then vast numbers of cars are not done.
wish I knew the exact scan tool you have,there are like 1000s now most are clones.
one of the best is this company that others clone 1/2 way.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00H9S71LW/ref=sspa_dk_detail_2?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B00H9S71LW&pd_rd_w=eRlyx&pf_rd_p=f0dedbe2-13c8-4136-a746-4398ed93cf0f&pd_rd_wg=3MxDm&pf_rd_r=6QPTNA1T8J1RK6TRRSG3&pd_rd_r=7b75b395-fb1b-11e8-b9c1-d922174ca744

best is if it lists this, the CAN bus does all 2004? and newer cars.
once it connects you can scan all federal codes (P0xxxx ) engine codes. and see TCM codes too. both all federal, (p1xxx codes are there and are suzuki only codes) all readers ive seen can read P0 and p1 factory codes.
never seen any of these fail, ever, it does all cars made USA (sold here) 96+
https://www.scantool.net/

Legislated OBD-II protocols:
ISO 15765-4 (CAN 250/500 kbps, 11/29 bit)
ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000)
ISO 9141-2 (Asian, European, Chrysler)
J1850 VPW (GM)
J1850 PWM (Ford)

PCM
the non sport 96+ uses pin 2 and 10 (i traced every inch to prove that
then in 1999 uses pin 7 only. (for PCM)PCM/ABS/SRS all 3.
pin 7 is K-Line of ISO 9141-2 and ISO 14230-4
pin2/10 is SAE J1850 PWM only (not SAE J1850 VPW) ( I do not know if Suzuki uses VPW or PWM (guess this) on this pin and the scan tool must do both)

I have never traced a sport.
so if pins 2 or 7 or 10 on your scan tool has those pins missing , as is common, (for sure $8 scan tools) it will fail on many old suzuki's
best I can tell, lacking car in hand
is in 1997 suzuki switched form pin 7 only to pin 2/10 pair, for sure true on all G16s 96 to 98
knowing this one fact on suzuki you do know why those pins missing on any scan tool renders it useless for those years.
the years later want to CAN bus. 2004? and 2008 all are can bus.

that is why it is best to have a real scan tool, not a clone, 2008 or newer, so it does all cars
if you buy clone it can be just clone of 1996 and will not work. (missing pins are the top clue)

also on CANADA cars all I said above may not be true, they started OBD2 in 1998, what what is there IDK, (parts swapping out of country is super bad) PCM, but my FSM shows, canada listed for OBD2, 1996 so... must be voluntary.

here is my code list
see all sport codes here, see factory codes p1xxx
http://www.troublecodes.net/suzuki/

(12-09-2018, 09:00 AM)thebanjoman Wrote:

(12-09-2018, 05:22 AM)fixkick Wrote: just like the internet (TCP-ip) and lots of ways to connect, up, to communicate (fiber/cable modem,/dialup./DSL, and SAT) once connected it works.

OBD2 is like that in that are are 4 ways to connect,
the connections all 4 use 4 sets of connection pins.
each uses different signal levels and a good too does all 4.
one way to do this is see what pins are wired in the scan too, most old tools are missing some the 4 sets of comm channels.
the worst is the $8 ELM tool that does not do all 4 not even close.

if the 97 ECU talks , why would the 98 not talk?

for now only what matters is not the computer or smart phone
what matters is hardware, if it works on all 4 levels of communications pin sets. only this matters first, if not 4 , then vast numbers of cars are not done.
wish I knew the exact scan tool you have,there are like 1000s now most are clones.
one of the best is this company that others clone 1/2 way.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00H9S71LW/ref=sspa_dk_detail_2?psc=1&pd_rd_i=B00H9S71LW&pd_rd_w=eRlyx&pf_rd_p=f0dedbe2-13c8-4136-a746-4398ed93cf0f&pd_rd_wg=3MxDm&pf_rd_r=6QPTNA1T8J1RK6TRRSG3&pd_rd_r=7b75b395-fb1b-11e8-b9c1-d922174ca744

best is if it lists this, the CAN bus does all 2004? and newer cars.
once it connects you can scan all federal codes (P0xxxx ) engine codes. and see TCM codes too. both all federal, (p1xxx codes are there and are suzuki only codes) all readers ive seen can read P0 and p1 factory codes.
never seen any of these fail, ever, it does all cars made USA (sold here) 96+
https://www.scantool.net/

Legislated OBD-II protocols:
ISO 15765-4 (CAN 250/500 kbps, 11/29 bit)
ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000)
ISO 9141-2 (Asian, European, Chrysler)
J1850 VPW (GM)
J1850 PWM (Ford)

PCM
the non sport 96+ uses pin 2 and 10 (i traced every inch to prove that
then in 1999 uses pin 7 only. (for PCM)PCM/ABS/SRS all 3.
pin 7 is K-Line of ISO 9141-2 and ISO 14230-4
pin2/10 is SAE J1850 PWM only (not SAE J1850 VPW) ( I do not know if Suzuki uses VPW or PWM (guess this) on this pin and the scan tool must do both)

I have never traced a sport.
so if pins 2 or 7 or 10 on your scan tool has those pins missing , as is common, (for sure $8 scan tools) it will fail on many old suzuki's
best I can tell, lacking car in hand
is in 1997 suzuki switched form pin 7 only to pin 2/10 pair, for sure true on all G16s 96 to 98
knowing this one fact on suzuki you do know why those pins missing on any scan tool renders it useless for those years.
the years later want to CAN bus. 2004? and 2008 all are can bus.

that is why it is best to have a real scan tool, not a clone, 2008 or newer, so it does all cars
if you buy clone it can be just clone of 1996 and will not work. (missing pins are the top clue)

also on CANADA cars all I said above may not be true, they started OBD2 in 1998, what what is there IDK, (parts swapping out of country is super bad) PCM, but my FSM shows, canada listed for OBD2, 1996 so... must be voluntary.

here is my code list
see all sport codes here, see factory codes p1xxx
http://www.troublecodes.net/suzuki/

I'm well aware of TCP/IP I've been an iT guy for 35 years working with Unix even before the 'commercial Internet'.. ;-) I put National Public Radio (NPR) on the Internet back in late '94 when I was a manager there.

I'm making space to get it into the shop and should have the old one's frame on the trailer tomorrow and pulling wires and everything I can to save and then get what I can by the pound for it. Next weekend I am hoping to have some.

I also have an old 'superchips' programmer for my old Dodge that is supposed to read codes so I will throw that on it and see if it reads anything. Other than that I will have to get better tools.

We'll turn this into a learning experience and get as much info as we can and maybe it will be helpful to others.