Vehicle stabilty

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Hi! 2 months ago I purchased a 1997 2 door convertible 1.6 16 valve 4x4 with 132k miles. I am working my way through the vehicle using the help here at fixkick. Now on to my question. My first concern has been safety, and the truck now rides great with new General Grabber 205/75-15 tires and aftermarket oem type dampers at all corners. I am running 23 PSI in all tires per sticker on the door jamb. Today while going into work just outside Philadelphia, PA I hit freezing rain. Now everybody had to slow dramatically, but it was all I could do to keep the back end from fishtailing during steady cruise. Acceleration and braking seemed fine, but I could feel the rear tires let go and come back while going straight at speeds ranging from 20-40 mph. The roads were small and medium sized secondary roads with rural type highways. I emphasized smooth transitions and avoided incident. To those more experienced than I am with the Tracker, does my description sound typical? Is this the nature of a light weight short wheelbase truck? I love my Tracker but I was shaken by the experience. Thanks.

[fixkick]

experiement with pressure

tries, are cupped or crowned i bet.
some tires behave different with pressure.
try 26 psi, if worse, then 20.

short wheel base is very hard to control if back end gets loose. a real pucker factor.
the worse conditions are ice near freeze point, one word for that "treacherous" liquid ball bearing....

the only real cure is true ice tires, sticky tires like sold on Canada. (they love them) and studs can be worse at 32f.
those tires,have brake skid test on ice, that is amazing.

Good luck to you !

[[email protected]]

experiement with pressure

Great. Will do. I go back to work tonight and will try by starting with 2 extra PSI in the rear tires only. Thanks.

tries, are cupped or crowned i bet.
some tires behave different with pressure.
try 26 psi, if worse, then 20.

short wheel base is very hard to control if back end gets loose. a real pucker factor.
the worse conditions are ice near freeze point, one word for that "treacherous" liquid ball bearing....

the only real cure is true ice tires, sticky tires like sold on Canada. (they love them) and studs can be worse at 32f.
those tires,have brake skid test on ice, that is amazing.

Good luck to you !

[fixkick]

for sure this is true, but hard to find?
the exact tire!, has a data sheet, the car engineer has that, he reads it
and sees the chart is matrix

air pressure , and weight on each tire, (mine is 500lbs per tire,2 door)
it shows, best pressure per exact tire you have and no others. side all flex and tread flex, are complex.(and work together)

is tire P205, LT205,???????
see? there are many 205 class tires,
and each has a perfect pressure to stop cupping and crowning.

the makers, love to hide this chart, and angers me, ....

the other way is in the shop , you chock bottom of tire, roll aways and see how the chock wears off.
try to get chock to wear off even across the width,, tedious to extreme this.

the other wAY , Start at 30 psi .
find a church parking lot, (empty,) and iced over,
drive slow (5mph?), and brake, and see how hard the brake cause a skid , stop and inflate down, repeat until you find best skid short.

this is how the ice tires, are rated, on real ice, and no other tires do this.

i think they go 20mph and slam on brakes,ABS off) and see the skid distance. i forget. (google finds it)
some ICE tires beat studs, even on a perfect stud road, (studs like super cold ice,not wet)
hope that helps.


wet ice, best stay home, and ICE dams, hind under bed.

[[email protected]]

for sure this is true, but hard to find?
the exact tire!, has a data sheet, the car engineer has that, he reads it
and sees the chart is matrix

air pressure , and weight on each tire, (mine is 500lbs per tire,2 door)
it shows, best pressure per exact tire you have and no others. side all flex and tread flex, are complex.(and work together)

[/u]I tried the 2 PSI extra in the rear tires. Roads were damp not freezing rain and temps in upper 30s. Subjectively, I seemed to notice the back of the vehicle more. Bumps seemed sharper. I am not sure I had more control. Hard to be sure if the tire or just me being more observant.

is tire P205, LT205,???????
see? there are many 205 class tires,
and each has a perfect pressure to stop cupping and crowning.

good question. I verified with TireRack that the General Grabber AT2 tires are a light truck tires. The sidewalls say 205/75-15. I purchased these tires over others as this tire in this size does have the snowflake symbol. I work in home nursing and need to drive in all weather and have historically been pleased when I spent the money for a true snow rated tire. Subjective observation is this tire has softer rubber than I have seen before plus the sidewalls deflect when I push them and my others tires in life have not presented this way. Not saying right or wrong, but just noting. I noted yesterday that this tire has no longitudinal grooves but instead has a block pattern. My other snow tires did have grooves that went around circumference in the direction of travel. The tire is described as a combination on road-off road tire. Maybe a block pattern is less stable?

the makers, love to hide this chart, and angers me, ....

the other way is in the shop , you chock bottom of tire, roll aways and see how the chock wears off.
try to get chock to wear off even across the width,, tedious to extreme this.

the other wAY , Start at 30 psi .
find a church parking lot, (empty,) and iced over,
drive slow (5mph?), and brake, and see how hard the brake cause a skid , stop and inflate down, repeat until you find best skid short.

[u]yes, I see that one needs to do their own research in the absence of manufacturer supplied data. This is interesting and I look forward to learning what works or not.

this is how the ice tires, are rated, on real ice, and no other tires do this.

i think they go 20mph and slam on brakes,ABS off) and see the skid distance. i forget. (google finds it)
some ICE tires beat studs, even on a perfect stud road, (studs like super cold ice,not wet)
hope that helps.


wet ice, best stay home, and ICE dams, hind under bed.

You bet.

[fixkick]

hello ,good ,morning and wish you safe !!!
THE ICE TIRES WIN ON WET ICE.
AND BETTER if Siped.(sp? sic)
get them siped, if not already

finding the data sheets, is not easy
most stores like yours, set tires to 36PSI, out door. (insurance company dictates? or since they have no data sheet they are clueless, (bingo)
If i was king each tired have the sheet attached, no bs.

not one time ever, did any tire store, in my life set tire pressure to car speck or datasheet,. 50+years.

its really my responsibility, to get pressure right after deviating from stock tires.

you had trouble a 20mph, i bet it was 32deg, icing, am i right.?
hard cold ice is easy to drive, not wet, (so called black ice) and better sanded,

there is no total cure for 32degr ice, in any car or any weight, its only a dream, traction can be 0. sorry.
ice tires,+ slow. is best.

or park, when we had that, everyone would call in Snow days.
i didnt, and wished had, every time.
60miles of hell.

Case in point 91 2door, (loves snow ,eats it for breakfastg)
I had LT235 on mine and run super low pressures., i did all the tests and took like a freakn week to get from Goodyear, to send a real sheet.
IIRC, it was 20PSI. (I forget)
Its all about insurance companies, they dont want to give the data sheets out, they think the users will get confused, and die.
its BS. ( i can get a datasheet on any part made, but tires, wow, what a royal PITA, understated !)
totally , how can FACTs be dangerous.? (load counts too)

ever seen long haul truck tires, those sheets, are everywhere, the driver is smart and uses them for load based calcs. of pressure.
on passenger tires, its pulling teeth, and is totally bs, their actions, IMO.


my LT needed, low pressure, in fact, the front tires, crowned so bad, the car could not be steered relaxed, wonder and weaves (horrid effects).
I used the chart, and did the chock tests, and no more bad steering (alignment was done first to no avail)

the bigger problem?
is if by magic your car run fast and true on 32deg F ice, 10 other cars hit you. its a fact, and is not solvable.
that is why parked is best, or have SURCHARGES for deliveries on ICE. big time more. (in fact have clause covering your full deductible)

win.

---

others use a snow car
a 1995 what ever,
rusted end to end, worth zilch
this is very common. in the snow belts.
very much so....