Vacuum Hose and VSV

[RickyD]

            Hi, new member here. I just picked up this Tracker really cheap knowing I have some work to do on it. It is a 94 with an A/T. It was idling fine but sometime during the alternator R&R I must have pulled off the vacuum hose coming from the evap VSV. Now the idle is high then real low and bounces back and forth. And now for the life of me I can't seem to find where or what the hose connects to. I've searched everywhere I could think of within reach of the hose but can't find a nipple this would connect to. Also, I don't recall whether or not the Fast Idle VSV was intact before I started working on it. I don't see the broken piece laying around anywhere so not sure if I broke it or if already was broken. Any idea where this vacuum hose connects, and where I can get another VSV? Thanks in advance to anyone that help me out.

[fixkick]

REDUX, car has wrong parts on engine, below is for engines not parts swapped...

welcome!!!!
wow an easy one, 8valve TBI.
my vacuum page cover this as does the under hood vacuum map, (seen on all uSA cars then)
that VSV , right rear is EVAP hose to canister below. so hose 44 fell off, easy. goes TB base nipple, and is full vacuum running, so now leak air. and will race and may hunt.
but that vSV is closed at idle and will not suck air,
nor will VSV egr
but the VSV dashpot will suck air. idling.

http://www.fixkick.com/sensors/8v-sensors.JPG

knowing the rule of suck you can find those 3 possible paths (lol)
i see your dash pot red VSV has a broken vent filter on top, missing it is and see fracture zone, make sure that fracture zone does not cause valve to leak.

---

on this old tad crazy ecu
air leaks cause idle reg surging
illegal today. this.
but this car will.... like clock work. a bad act for un skilled driver with A/t like a young daughter.
car surging badly...
the ECU sees illegal RPM and hunts it madly with ISC.
my 91 does it too. so do earlier.
I think 1996 hunting was cured. not sure,

[RickyD]

welcome!!!!
wow an easy one, 8valve TBI.
my vacuum page cover this as does the under hood vacuum map, (seen on all uSA cars then)
that VSV , right rear is EVAP hose to canister below. so hose 44 fell off, easy. goes TB base nipple, and is full vacuum running, so now leak air. and will race and may hunt.
but that vSV is closed at idle and will not suck air,
nor will VSV egr
but the VSV dashpot will suck air. idling.

http://www.fixkick.com/sensors/8v-sensors.JPG

knowing the rule of suck you can find those 3 possible paths (lol)
i see your dash pot red VSV has a broken vent filter on top, missing it is and see fracture zone, make sure that fracture zone does not cause valve to leak.

---

on this old tad crazy ecu
air leaks cause idle reg surging
illegal today. this.
but this car will.... like clock work. a bad act for un skilled driver with A/t like a young daughter.
car surging badly...
the ECU sees illegal RPM and hunts it madly with ISC.
my 91 does it too. so do earlier.
I think 1996 hunting was cured. not sure,

Thanks for the reply. I have looked at the diagram you posted before. I understand that the #44hose will go to the TB. Problem is, I have looked all around the TB and intake for the nipple to plug it into. As you can see by the pics, there is no visible nipple anywhere to connect to. I have felt all around, blindly in most cases for the nipple and just cant find it.

As for the Red VSV, the missing cap, you mentioned it is a vent??? It's ok to run it without this cap? If not, any suggestions as to where I can get a new VSV?? Again thanks for your help

[fixkick]

SOLVED !
sorry, look for it here (2 generations and 2 transmission types. (4 manifolds) , see right manifold, i think that is more close,see evap VSV.
and 4 more for 89/90 years, (89-95 here in usa and more years, world wide)

http://www.fixkick.com/IDLE-AIR/Slide_Sh...age_1.html
the vent filter, is when the ecu, switches the valve, the vacuum ends on that port by allowing outside air to stuck in ,to that port and that air is filtered so that dirt is not sucked into the valve. (purpose)
if only the damage is the filter missing then it sucks in dirt and later can clogs or sticks the valve.
if the cracks are bad enough (damage is random in nature) then it might damage the actual valve below, just look carefully see the extent of damage to top of valve. (the valve can be bench tested with hand vacuum tool and 12vdc battery.

here is my 91, 8v, evap hose.
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v-Show-bo...age_6.html
with intake filters on VSV
and the alternator is retracted.
sorry i told you wrong, all i have are m/t photos... but there is a nipple for that valve. to hard plenum vacuum somewhere,
and is not TB.

---

ever get the engine serial number off the left rear flange?
the letter in the center is year
G16Lnnnnnn L = letter year code, is this a 95 or 89 engine.

im looking at your 3 photos now more carefully.... engine swaps and parts swaps are very common this old.
Your TB is 91 or newer
but why does your intake manifold look alike a 89/90
there are 3 water/air sensors there, the front sensor water for gage. 1 wire,
the rear sensor is air (AIT) 2 wire.
the center ECT sensor is the give away, the center has 2 wires from 1991 and newer and 1 wire, on 89/90 why does yours only have 1 wire (this usa engine?)
see the green plug here (91) that is ECT, it has 2 wires, but yours is WRONG.
see mine.
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v-Show-bo...ge_19.html

now we know why hoses dont match up.

the 89./90 engines have no EVAP, VSV, NONE.
the 80/90s hose goes to the top TB air horn (not a vacuum there) nipple that your 91 TB does not HAVE.
so there you go , I bet your engine serial is
G16J or K code is 89/90
seen here.
http://www.fixkick.com/specs/Body-TAGS/m...rial1w.jpg

there are only 3 cures,(1 a half)
1: use a correct intake manifold.
2: use Tee tap , on the other hose that is marked DASH pot nipple, and its fixed for 50cents. this is hard vacuum.
3: leave the hose lay free, and let it smell bad, as it will. (venting to air) illegal in all smog station checks, you fail.

---

here is 89 wrong way
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v/vacuum%...age_6.html

see wrong manifold on left with 1 wire ECT?

http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v/vacuum%...age_6.html

---

PS
, if not in usa.?
the engine, year codes are MISSING. (can be)
sorry, but our laws cover this rule only.

[RickyD]

SOLVED !
sorry, look for it here (2 generations and 2 transmission types. (4 manifolds) , see right manifold, i think that is more close,see evap VSV.
and 4 more for 89/90 years, (89-95 here in usa and more years, world wide)

http://www.fixkick.com/IDLE-AIR/Slide_Sh...age_1.html
the vent filter, is when the ecu, switches the valve, the vacuum ends on that port by allowing outside air to stuck in ,to that port and that air is filtered so that dirt is not sucked into the valve. (purpose)
if only the damage is the filter missing then it sucks in dirt and later can clogs or sticks the valve.
if the cracks are bad enough (damage is random in nature) then it might damage the actual valve below, just look carefully see the extent of damage to top of valve. (the valve can be bench tested with hand vacuum tool and 12vdc battery.

here is my 91, 8v, evap hose.
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v-Show-bo...age_6.html
with intake filters on VSV
and the alternator is retracted.
sorry i told you wrong, all i have are m/t photos... but there is a nipple for that valve. to hard plenum vacuum somewhere,
and is not TB.

---

ever get the engine serial number off the left rear flange?
the letter in the center is year
G16Lnnnnnn L = letter year code, is this a 95 or 89 engine.

im looking at your 3 photos now more carefully.... engine swaps and parts swaps are very common this old.
Your TB is 91 or newer
but why does your intake manifold look alike a 89/90
there are 3 water/air sensors there, the front sensor water for gage. 1 wire,
the rear sensor is air (AIT) 2 wire.
the center ECT sensor is the give away, the center has 2 wires from 1991 and newer and 1 wire, on 89/90 why does yours only have 1 wire (this usa engine?)
see the green plug here (91) that is ECT, it has 2 wires, but yours is WRONG.
see mine.
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v-Show-bo...ge_19.html

now we know why hoses dont match up.

the 89./90 engines have no EVAP, VSV, NONE.
the 80/90s hose goes to the top TB air horn (not a vacuum there) nipple that your 91 TB does not HAVE.
so there you go , I bet your engine serial is
G16J or K code is 89/90
seen here.
http://www.fixkick.com/specs/Body-TAGS/m...rial1w.jpg

there are only 3 cures,(1 a half)
1: use a correct intake manifold.
2: use Tee tap , on the other hose that is marked DASH pot nipple, and its fixed for 50cents. this is hard vacuum.
3: leave the hose lay free, and let it smell bad, as it will. (venting to air) illegal in all smog station checks, you fail.

---

here is 89 wrong way
http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v/vacuum%...age_6.html

see wrong manifold on left with 1 wire ECT?

http://www.fixkick.com/engine/8v/vacuum%...age_6.html

---

PS
, if not in usa.?
the engine, year codes are MISSING. (can be)
sorry, but our laws cover this rule only.

Thanks for the pictures and more information. I am assuming this is a car made for the USA. I live in Florida. It has a Florida title. Like I said, I just bought it about 2 weeks ago. I am out of town at the moment and will look for the engine codes when I get back next weekend and if it tells me something different than being titled as a 1994. I'll get back with you. And I do appreciate the help. Thanks.

[fixkick]

ok, Florida. lots of these cars in Canada and S. America. too..
and good old ebay , parts drift all about the earth...
that is a 89/90 intake manifold and (most times same is engine, as engine swappers, would be lazy to pull it.
then means the nipple is missing , there, as the 89/90s does not use hard vacuum for EVAP, (very crude and not VSV either)
1994 engine code, is the amazing code 4
G1g4nnnnnnn where n = serial sequence.

here is my decoder
http://www.fixkick.com/specs/VIN-motor-decoder.html


these cars are known for mixed part, this old,
lucky for you its just a 50 cent TEE fitting, and bam same.
i wonder how they hooked up the WRONG ECT.
91 when to 2 wires for accuracy. and then on to today.

[RickyD]

       

ok, Florida. lots of these cars in Canada and S. America. too..
and good old ebay , parts drift all about the earth...
that is a 89/90 intake manifold and (most times same is engine, as engine swappers, would be lazy to pull it.
then means the nipple is missing , there, as the 89/90s does not use hard vacuum for EVAP, (very crude and not VSV either)
1994 engine code, is the amazing code 4
G1g4nnnnnnn where n = serial sequence.

here is my decoder
http://www.fixkick.com/specs/VIN-motor-decoder.html


these cars are known for mixed part, this old,
lucky for you its just a 50 cent TEE fitting, and bam same.
i wonder how they hooked up the WRONG ECT.
91 when to 2 wires for accuracy. and then on to today.

Well I got back home and started to tinker around with the Tracker. The idle problem I had magically fixed itself as now it is running smoothly again. So the idle problem I had is gone with no apparent reason as to why it did that. As for the motor year I looked all over and found this code on the back side of engine on drivers side. "G16A" No other numbers or letters could be found. Will that help with engine year. VIN CODE 2CNBE18U3R69xxxx (x last 4 numbers). Title says 1994

I guess for $500 and some minor work... (brakes, AT pan gasket, one window regulator) I can't ask for too much. Added to pics of the car just to show what it is.

[fixkick]

Well I got back home and started to tinker around with the Tracker. The idle problem I had magically fixed itself as now it is running smoothly again. So the idle problem I had is gone with no apparent reason as to why it did that.
This is so common, with ISC sticking, or brake poster diaphragm cracks. etc.
or the duty cycle set wrong. on the cusp of near closed ISC, and a timing leak puts it, OUT OF RANGE.
sorry for my type.
G16A is not A it a 4,
note hoq a 4 looks like and A, 4 = 1994,
only usa engines have code there, so if code for year missing its and imported G16. (from Mexico or canada,, imported from japan as a JDM engine)
its USA laws that dictate all this... its 4, there, and can be hard to tell.
my guess now if its a 4, then some one needed a new intake, and got the wrong one, i can see its the 1st year manifold, easy.
its no big deal, use Tee fitting added and EVAP now works.

As for the motor year I looked all over and found this code on the back side of engine on drivers side. "G16A" No other numbers or letters could be found.

ahhhhh, that is not serial number, those car casted in numbers, die cast. alum.
the left lower , engine flange at the bell has the number, with serial, G164123456 (see that 4 that is year, the 123456 is serial number of engine)
its not cast in place, its stamped on with a steel embossed stamp die and hammer,

Will that help with engine year. VIN CODE 2CNBE18U3R69xxxx (x last 4 numbers). Title says 1994,

all that is body codes, not engine.
The U = GM code for 8v valve head.
the 2CN means made in CAMI plant, canada.
3R (3 is 1993 model car, R is plant code)

I guess for $500 and some minor work... (brakes, AT pan gasket, one window regulator) I can't ask for too much. Added to pics of the car just to show what it is.

its a deal, ive done many like that $500 cars..
getting all air leaks fixed first then doing the duty cycle , right , then the ISC is at 50% and now idle can never be wrong hot,
when set correctly the ISC can drop idle to 400 rpm easy. ( if it wanted to but does not, the ECU is hard coded for 800s , when a leak happens
the isc closes and hides the leak in under 1 second flat)

imagine if you will a huge tank of water, say 500 gallons.
and 3 persons with buckets and the huge tank is filled to 250 gallons, at 50% capacity.
and the first two bucket men are ISC man 1, and IAC man 2, man1 can adds water and other can only remove it ( the ECU is bucket 1 and 2)
bucket man 3 is the wild card, the wild man who is thief . (water thief, and sometimes maniacal.)

the thief steals water. and can sometimes he , can dip his bucket faster than man 1,
the results is the tank goes dry, (and engine stalls.) an analogy,.,.
the thief is vacuum leaks.
or can be man1 or 2, has a broken arm (isc sticks, ecu bad, or in backup mode or limphome both cancel idle controls ISC goes off line)

so if idle is not 800 hot, (+ or - 50 rpm) then we know one of 3 things, the thief is to active. or the ISC is malf'ing. or the calibration is wrong
that being not at 250 gallons. normal. called 50% duty cycle..

it can be as simple as some played with the idle bleed screw on the air horn.(unscrewed)
or changed the idle stop screw, both wrong, double trouble, if both set wrong (open) the ISC will go 100% closed. or 99%
then next day the 99% hits 100 and ISC is now closed 100% and off line. it can not close more than 100%.
when that happens idle controls are off line. and out of control..
one more idea what is crazy PO with his 1989 intake , put in TEE fitting, to make evap work right,
I also see the VSV EVAP forward mount is screw is missing that is because there is no VSV here, in 1989. so he just found a black single hole there, and
screwed on the 94 bracket there. now the hose has no home, on the VSV (evap.) the fix is put a standard vacuum TEE on the dash pot. vacuum line.
the one the feeds the dash pot VSV valve. (hard vacuum at idle)
now the EVAP works 100%
id not TEE the map line, its sacred, id never mess with that line.


This photo is very clear (top left, rear of engine bell)
see this photo.? see how its a STAMPING< not a CASTING?
this is left side of engine, 100% rear and is the rear engine to bell housing flange there.
The red arrow 2 is front of car direction.
to the left is exhaust pipe and that huge bolt is the largest bolt on the trans, engine connection.
this view is looking down. to the rear of exhaust manifold. my T is your 4. T= 96, 4 = 1994. then a 6 digit serial.

---

first things i do are.

1: make sure dashpot servo rod retracts 100% running,)
2: not running, i retract it by hand the look at the TV eyeballed< it must be 100% closed. 99.9 or .0005" gap. it so closed water can not pass there.
3: then count turns on the air bleed. from closed, do not force it closed, just gently, its a needle type valve, and all have that rule.

if idle controls fail 1/2 time, turn it (bleed) in 1 turn, if idle then regulates, then it was out too far.
the calibration is not easy, lacking a scope or duty meter.

with the duty meter attached there, we turn the bleed to 50% and call it a day.
sometimes if real lucky, and your cheap DMM is real fast, (most are slugs) it will show 7vdc = 50% duty
this is because its so fast it averages 14v and 0v on the square wave signal of ISC the 7v is 1/2 duty.
one of my 5 meters, do that. other s not.
here is my cheap duty meter, it does work. sold on ebay.
http://www.fixkick.com/IDLE-AIR/dutycycle/2800b.JPG

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not to mention clean ISC ...