no spark

[stickerbuoy]

Hey guys,
I have a '95 2-door 16V Auto (Canadian). It is currently sitting on a mountain pass and will not start. No spark at plugs or distributor. I caught a ride into the nearest town, but I'm somewhat stranded right now.

About 2 weeks ago it died after about about 10 minutes of driving on the highway. I pulled over and turned it off. It started back up again no problem.
The next day it did the exact same thing at the exact same place on the highway.

2 days ago I started driving back home (was at the parent's place for Christmas). After 4 hours of uneventful driving, we stopped for the night. It got turned off and on a few times as we ran a few errands in town. The 3rd or 4th time I tried to start it it almost caught, but quickly died. All subsequent attempts to start it that night failed.

The next morning it still wouldn't start initially. Fuel pump seemed to be working (could hear air getting sucked into gas tank when the key was turned). We pulled a spark plug wire and grounded it with a screw driver to test spark, and it fired right up.

Took it to mechanic, but since it was running great, he couldn't find anything. I decided to try and finish the rest of the journey home (perhaps not so smart, but what's done is done). A few hours into the trip, the car died again. Once again I pulled over, and it started up fine. That happened a few more times. The 3rd or 4th time I had to do the screwdriver in spark plug wire again to get it to go. Finally it died just before a mountain pass, and would not start. Tested the spark at the plug, wire, and distributor, and couldn't get anything.

By that point it was dark, snowing, and cold, so rather than keep troubleshooting I caught a ride with somebody who stopped to help.

There are no error codes being thrown. My cousin thinks it's the ECU, and I'm starting to think he might be right. Battery is brand new and was turning over just fine when I left it (650 cold cranking amps, so no problems there).

I have at home two other sidekicks (all Canadian):
-94 manual 4-door 16v 1.6L
-96 auto 4-door 16V 1.6L

Right now my buddy is pulling out the computer, distributor, and ignition coil from the '94. I figured the computer from the '94 would have the best chance of working in my '95 2-door. Any suggestions?

[fixkick]

Hey guys,
I have a '95 2-door 16V Auto (Canadian). It is currently sitting on a mountain pass and will not start. No spark at plugs or distributor. I caught a ride into the nearest town, but I'm somewhat stranded right now. OUCH, (does the CEL glow key on?) if not fuses blew, or ECU internal caps shorted, the do 1 time.


About 2 weeks ago it died after about about 10 minutes of driving on the highway. I pulled over and turned it off. It started back up again no problem.
The next day it did the exact same thing at the exact same place on the highway.

2 days ago I started driving back home (was at the parent's place for Christmas). After 4 hours of uneventful driving, we stopped for the night. It got turned off and on a few times as we ran a few errands in town. The 3rd or 4th time I tried to start it it almost caught, but quickly died. All subsequent attempts to start it that night failed.

The next morning it still wouldn't start initially. Fuel pump seemed to be working (could hear air getting sucked into gas tank when the key was turned). We pulled a spark plug wire and grounded it with a screw driver to test spark, and it fired right up.

Took it to mechanic, but since it was running great, he couldn't find anything. I decided to try and finish the rest of the journey home (perhaps not so smart, but what's done is done).
A few hours into the trip, the car died again. Once again I pulled over, and it started up fine. That happened a few more times. The 3rd or 4th time I had to do the screwdriver in spark plug wire again to get it to go. Finally it died just before a mountain pass, and would not start. Tested the spark at the plug, wire, and distributor, and couldn't get anything.

By that point it was dark, snowing, and cold, so rather than keep troubleshooting I caught a ride with somebody who stopped to help.

There are no error codes being thrown. ( crank for 5 seconds with diag-jumper inserted, get code 41 or 42 and that is it. bad cmp or bad ignitor;.)
you mean it flashes code 12, running and stalled, drive with the jumper. if it starts. or crank and watch for 41/42s/
CEL dead is bad ECU, (or fuse)
CEL that will not flash on demand, bad ECU.



My cousin thinks it's the ECU, and I'm starting to think he might be right.
Battery is brand new and was turning over just fine when I left it (650 cold cranking amps, so no problems there). its good.

I have at home two other sidekicks (all Canadian):
-94 manual 4-door 16v 1.6L no good for auto this ecu)
-96 auto 4-door 16V 1.6L (no good for parts, its OBD2)

Right now my buddy is pulling out the computer, distributor, and ignition coil from the '94. I figured the computer from the '94 would have the best chance of working in my '95 2-door. Any suggestions? (it will start but , your 3speed, will not lock TCC up, or of 4speed, The TCM will go quite nuts., should start ok.

tell me about the CEL was it glowing at STALL?.???? if not its crashed.

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the ECU if good, and not needing new caps as all 95 need, 1 time. will report the CMP dead, in 5seconds cranking, very reliably code 42, code 41 is ignition signal dead.
do not pull the dizzy unless you stop it at TDC #1 firing, or you will lose the timing and compound all this.....

The ECU will report spark bad, (primary side)
do you have a tachmeter?, does the needle deflect 1/4" cranking, if not the (coil, ignitor or CMP are dead) but the CMP is discounted with Diag jumper, no code 42's during 5 sec. crank.
the Tach must twitch upscale a tad, 0.3k rpm, it moves tiny bit, this is spark feed back, moving the tach,,, code 41 kills tacho sigs.

also bad ground to dizzy
see my bad ground list for 95
G109

http://www.fixkick.com/Good_Bad_Ugly/com...lures.html

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the mt drives with A/T ECu, but never tried, reverse way.
ill look up the pins on the 2 ECU's, and see what's there. .later.

[stickerbuoy]

Made it home. My buddy drove out and we hauled it back with a Uhaul trailer.

FI fuse was blown, so I replaced it and it started up for about 1 second before blowing again.
I also pulled the computer out and the circuit board looks good (nothing burnt anyway). I have some capacitors kicking around so I will replace those while I have it out.

It's been a long day so I will resume troubleshooting tomorrow.

I have indeed been reading your site for some time now (I have been following your posts on other forums too). I can tell you have put a lot of work into documenting your knowledge and experience. Thank-you, it is a great resource!

[fixkick]

FI
blows for (most common as wires can short too) are
Bad ECU , the caps are shorted, in side, $5 fix.
or a shorted fuel pump.
one guy put fuse on the pump ( I use and ampclamp meter and measure it.) the pump uses 4amps. one guy put a fuse in the pump pink wire 10amp to see is if blew
the pump comes on line with ECU command so its not possible to pull ECU see fuse not blow and say bad ECU, because of the way the fuel pump relay works
you can unplug the fuel pump, at the rear left tail light, see large conn. see pink wire, that is the pump , pull this conn. blow fuses now., yes, bad pump.

your welcome!, i did most of it , in 2007 late at night , and had insomnia. long gone that.. now .. (was due to rotating shifts)

here is your ECU
and if bad here are the top fixes.. the corner cap, large garbage can shape, near the main connect, not damaged, or leaking green boric acid there (all time high failure)
my page will tell you this is the first parts to change, 1 time ever, if not done already, all rubycons, fail, all, until, 1996 and then like magic, non ever fail.. hard proof of that.
kick the ruby's to the curb. DAY 1, this is a best DAY1 fix..


http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/ECU.html

the ECU turns on, boots and closes the FP relay for 3 seconds, (before crank) the pump can be shorted and blow the fuse during this 3 second interval.

replaced the caps with same polarity.
i even have a source for real high qual caps. there,

actual ecu. 16v obd1
http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/ECU16v_92-95.html


If these cap's were Nichicon UPJ series, we'd not be reading this.... See how to buy em'.
only 33 cents, too.

[stickerbuoy]

Caps on ECU are not shorted, and have no leakage. No burn marks anywhere on ECU or components. For now car is running with new fuse. Looks like we've got ourselves a good old-fashioned intermittent electrical problem...

[fixkick]

they suck.
but is the ECU or pump.
put a inlinefuse in the pump line, 10-15 amp slow blow. then when it pops.. you go , dang.
the left rear tail light has the wire there, in easy access, its big pink wire.

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those caps if rubycons are no good. (still there , black cased caps?)
some leak
some just dry out inside, no signs. and every bounce of the road., gets a shorted cap, and do 1/2 the time heal to no short. lots of posts for that.. huge...
look for case bulging, splits, distortions, or cracks,on caps.

one more kick weakness. the fuel pump wires is weak, end to end, undersized and when the pump draws to much current but is just tad less that what it takes to blow the FI fuse
it causes a main power feed voltage drop to the ECU. the ECU reboots, in the middle of running and engine. horrid effects. this.

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to be real. the short is on the blue-black wire...

http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/92-95MPI-eng-...e-huge.png

[stickerbuoy]

a quick update:

Drove the car till it died again. This time no fuse blew. Sounded like no fuel when I tried to start it, fuel pump didn't turn on with key on, no error codes (except 12), and relay tested fine. I dropped the fuel tank, and there is a crack right through the top. I'm guessing rust and who knows what else has clogged and/or killed the fuel pump. The good news is I have the other two sidekicks that I bought for parts, so I will do a straight tank swap. I think I'll pick up a new fuel filter first though.

Anything I'm forgetting?

[fixkick]

great inspection work !!, i bet the pump was blowing that FI fuse. sucking in lots of chucks of rust, the pump sock will be clogged too.

[stickerbuoy]

Looks like I finally found the culprit. After dropping the fuel tank I determined that the gas was clean, and the fuel pump worked fine. I finally cracked open the left tail light, and discovered the melted connector. The plastic was not salvageable, so I snipped everything and used bullet connectors. She fired up first try.

Dropping the tank was not a complete waste though, since I was able to find and fix a leak.

Anyway, thanks for all the help! I will definitely be packing a few more tools on the next road trip.

[fixkick]

worst weve seen , thanks for SHARING !@!
that damage is from heat, caused by the connector corroding..making resistance. this connector is in a very dirty spot.

nice work, and rapid discovers ..

cheers to you !