Geo Tracker Transmission Whining

[sina27]

Hello,

Got a soft top 1996 tracker, 2WD 5 speed manual 

The person I bought it from over a year ago had the transmission re-manufactured, and put in a new clutch at the same time. 
Since then, I noticed there was balking and hard to shift symptoms. I noticed that the clutch cable was tightened bit too much (not enough free play). Since then,
I replaced the clutch cable, put in some Penzoil Synchromesh, and just to be on the safe side I replaced the 2 plastic pieces at the bottom of the shifter. I adjusted the clutch cable free play perfectly, so that theres 1/2 inch play at pedal - and the clutch release arm itself has a tiny bit of free play as to not damage the TO bearing. 

Now, the car drives and shifts very smoothly. However, when I first start up the car in the morning, I hear a "whining" sounds coming from below the gearshift assembly (assuming its coming from the transmission). The whining sound is louder when I start it up in cold mornings, and the sound is only present when the clutch is not pressed in. The sound is present in neutral and when in all other gears, but once I press the clutch in the sound goes away. 
Additionally, after the car is fully warmed up, the whining sound is completely gone (not minimal sound, but the sound is completely gone). 

I'm assuming the sounds could be from a bad throwout bearing? Or can the sound be from the input shaft bearing? Which one is the likely culprit?  
I'm just a little confused as to why any of these bearings could possibly be going bad so soon after the transmission and clutch were fully rebuilt. 

Any advice would be appreciated; I've never done a clutch or transmission job, so I don't know how easy it would be to change out the bearing(s).

Thank You

[fixkick]

Hello,

Got a soft top 1996 tracker, 2WD 5 speed manual 

The person I bought it from over a year ago had the transmission re-manufactured, and put in a new clutch at the same time. 
Since then, I noticed there was balking and hard to shift symptoms. I noticed that the clutch cable was tightened bit too much (not enough free play). Since then,
I replaced the clutch cable, put in some Penzoil Synchromesh, and just to be on the safe side I replaced the 2 plastic pieces at the bottom of the shifter. I adjusted the clutch cable free play perfectly, so that theres 1/2 inch play at pedal - and the clutch release arm itself has a tiny bit of free play as to not damage the TO bearing. 

Now, the car drives and shifts very smoothly. However, when I first start up the car in the morning, I hear a "whining" sounds coming from below the gearshift assembly (assuming its coming from the transmission). The whining sound is louder when I start it up in cold mornings, and the sound is only present when the clutch is not pressed in. The sound is present in neutral and when in all other gears, but once I press the clutch in the sound goes away. 
Additionally, after the car is fully warmed up, the whining sound is completely gone (not minimal sound, but the sound is completely gone). 

I'm assuming the sounds could be from a bad throwout bearing? Or can the sound be from the input shaft bearing? Which one is the likely culprit?  
I'm just a little confused as to why any of these bearings could possibly be going bad so soon after the transmission and clutch were fully rebuilt. 



Any advice would be appreciated; I've never done a clutch or transmission job, so I don't know how easy it would be to change out the bearing(s).

Thank You

"but once I press the clutch in the sound goes away". in neutral is key ,here. as only pilot shaft and cluster spins in neutral
what happens if you just press pedal and take up that slack only? at the pedal this gently presses the throw out bearing only (?) (just slack gone)?

seems like 1 of the 3 main bearings in the box are bad.
bearing 3/2,27,29,31.
but one other thing can make noise of any shop ever touched bolt 54, if this is not calibrated right the 2 gears bind. (35/50) reverse.
the book is not clear on these parts,54.  what I did is (never remove 54) I loosen it and try to get the gear 50 centralized,  by tapping the bolt 54, from sides.
even trying to do that in neutral, idling. so tap the head of 54 at say 4 points on the compass. 90deg apart and one hit may make it quite or will self center and go quote.
removing 54 bolt trans box in car , invites dropping part 52 into to bottom of case,  no fun that.

in neutral shaft 7 is stalled. (car not moving.) so neutral is the best test.(if fails and does)





this part below is very tricky to setup. box split i just adjusted the bolt until the 2 gear turned clean and free, no binding up as it loves to do.

[sina27]

Hello,

Got a soft top 1996 tracker, 2WD 5 speed manual 

The person I bought it from over a year ago had the transmission re-manufactured, and put in a new clutch at the same time. 
Since then, I noticed there was balking and hard to shift symptoms. I noticed that the clutch cable was tightened bit too much (not enough free play). Since then,
I replaced the clutch cable, put in some Penzoil Synchromesh, and just to be on the safe side I replaced the 2 plastic pieces at the bottom of the shifter. I adjusted the clutch cable free play perfectly, so that theres 1/2 inch play at pedal - and the clutch release arm itself has a tiny bit of free play as to not damage the TO bearing. 

Now, the car drives and shifts very smoothly. However, when I first start up the car in the morning, I hear a "whining" sounds coming from below the gearshift assembly (assuming its coming from the transmission). The whining sound is louder when I start it up in cold mornings, and the sound is only present when the clutch is not pressed in. The sound is present in neutral and when in all other gears, but once I press the clutch in the sound goes away. 
Additionally, after the car is fully warmed up, the whining sound is completely gone (not minimal sound, but the sound is completely gone). 

I'm assuming the sounds could be from a bad throwout bearing? Or can the sound be from the input shaft bearing? Which one is the likely culprit?  
I'm just a little confused as to why any of these bearings could possibly be going bad so soon after the transmission and clutch were fully rebuilt. 



Any advice would be appreciated; I've never done a clutch or transmission job, so I don't know how easy it would be to change out the bearing(s).

Thank You

"but once I press the clutch in the sound goes away". in neutral is key ,here. as only pilot shaft and cluster spins in neutral
what happens if you just press pedal and take up that slack only? at the pedal this gently presses the throw out bearing only (?) (just slack gone)?

seems like 1 of the 3 main bearings in the box are bad.
bearing 3/2,27,29,31.
but one other thing can make noise of any shop ever touched bolt 54, if this is not calibrated right the 2 gears bind. (35/50) reverse.
the book is not clear on these parts,54.  what I did is (never remove 54) I loosen it and try to get the gear 50 centralized,  by tapping the bolt 54, from sides.
even trying to do that in neutral, idling. so tap the head of 54 at say 4 points on the compass. 90deg apart and one hit may make it quite or will self center and go quote.
removing 54 bolt trans box in car , invites dropping part 52 into to bottom of case,  no fun that.

in neutral shaft 7 is stalled. (car not moving.) so neutral is the best test.(if fails and does)





this part below is very tricky to setup. box split i just adjusted the bolt until the 2 gear turned clean and free, no binding up as it loves to do.

Thanks, fixkick - 

I'll take a look at bolt 54 (the diagram you posted is for 4WD, but its the same for my 2WD??). 
So I'll back out the bolt a turn or two while the car is idling in neutral, and give it the compass taps to see if the sound goes away?
The sound is also present when I'm in any other gear - not just neutral though. But as long as the clutch is pressed in, the sounds goes away. 
Next time I start my car I'll see if a "gentle" push quiets up the sound - and if you say it does, then that would make it the throw out bearing, correct? 

Hopefully thats the only issue.

[fixkick]

Thanks, fixkick - 

I'll take a look at bolt 54 (the diagram you posted is for 4WD, but its the same for my 2WD??). 
So I'll back out the bolt a turn or two while the car is idling in neutral, and give it the compass taps to see if the sound goes away?
The sound is also present when I'm in any other gear - not just neutral though. But as long as the clutch is pressed in, the sounds goes away. 
Next time I start my car I'll see if a "gentle" push quiets up the sound - and if you say it does, then that would make it the throw out bearing, correct? 

Hopefully thats the only issue.

The cluster there (7 gears(2 for REV) spins in R,N,12,3,4,5gears but only  at any time the clutch pedal is UP, (foot off the clutch pedal)
the Cluster stops only if the foot is fully depressing to the pedal (clutch not bad or dragging)
that is why I said Neutral is the best test,  (but makes noise in all gears) but in neutral all the other gears are stalled. (shaft 7 is stalled)
In neutral less parts are spinning , then if clutch if fully depressed no parts in the box are spinning,  (all these facts help find the cause) and neutral takes the case.
if  box makes noise with many gears stalled, it is not those gears or there bearings bad.
the gentle pressing of the pedal, taking up all slack in the cable, cause the clutch bell FORK to just kills the THROW OUT bearing, in most or all cases of the noise starts or  gets worse
the THROWOUT is bad (bearing)

This box is what I call a constant mess box.  all gears are in mesh with the cluster.
so there are other bearings that do spin in neutral. 20,22,47 spin when cluster spins in Neutural
Also the 5speed box there is no 4th gear at all due to the main shaft 7 and pilot shaft LOCKUP 1:1 end to end, (and cluster float free) and if noise ends in 4trh gear that speaks too.
I rebuilt my box using 2 transmissions, (suzuki has no parts for the box(or like 1 or 2 max) the bearings I reaplaced all BALL bearing.
most times the caged rollers do jot fail. (low stress on them)

the top most  failure is the bearing #3 then 27
the 2wd box has special long #7 shaft, that is all there is on 2wd, just that shaft #7 and tail housing to match.
at 4wd has no rear 2wd housing and short shaft that reached the 4wd transfer case input splines.
but none of that matters #7 due to car is parked, box 5sp is in netural,and it makes noise. shaft #7 is stalled. now.

the other secret on 5sp is Reverse. gear.
this gear in NON Synchromesh gear and is what I call the Canary gear (miners jargon) this gear is the first gear to grind or balk, if the clutch ever drags. (first to sing)
the first synro gear to fail is #2 due to huge stress if car is city car and tons of stop signals or traffic.  it wears and gets slow to shift, late shifts or balks, into 2nd.

what the other owner did, lacking receipts is anyones guess, 
one guy in Florida sent me clutch (orig from china) that look like cave men made it,  really was  joke,  with hand made and hammered out parts. 
Parts are big problem now, after market parts,  I used only Koyo and Timken bearings in mine. No china, NONAME parts, many from china are not traceable at all, no name.

[fixkick]

that reverse idler gear on the case side, is tricky bugger.
if you look there, it has no way to index it. (BOX in car)
The shaft and mount 52 flop around if the bolt 54 is loose.
some JIffyboob(quacklube) lube joints think this is the Gear lube fill/check level bolt and remove it, oops that will not go good at all, ever.
super easy mistake to do, mines marked on top "NO" in shapie pen,
I'D say off hand if 54 fiddling (tuning) is not the cure in Neutral, the Throw out is bad or box is

Most of these cars have one more tricky issue and that is the cable. (it has large friction)
does not fully retract, with foot off the PEDAL, so that the fee play is not really at the THROWOUT bearing and bearing spins all the time. running.
that is why I'd man handle the bell lever (hands on lever) in NEUTRAL, hand brake set, wheels chocked up.
then grab the lever on the BELL and flex it hard by hamd see of the Throw out makes noise or not, or or changes pitch or level of noise, (it must be silent if bell level fork , kisses the Throw out bearing. if not it is bad Throw out. (at the least)

[fixkick]

one killer or this box is for sure low lube.
caused by,
sure seals bad but what else?
yes those 2 dirty rotten rubber plugs up top on the shift reals (used after the rails were drilled and honed in the factory)
then SUZUKI used LAME GLUE that turns to Dust, even 10 years later.
they fall out out and now leaks GL4.
vast do this, and for 50cents of RTV glue will never fail,  I use the word glue to be simple (sure its not really kids glue)
the case seam sealant  is super good, and does not leak, have P/N and sources.

#13 code is very fitting. the simply fall out,  home depot has some rubber plugs that can fit.

[fixkick]

the 2wd box #7 is 2 inches longer here. there are some simple minor difffernces in rear seals.  for sure the one at 54 ID moved to tail housing end.
and the missing seal near #30
the 4wd rear casing iS DRY
the 2wd tail housing is WET.
other differences exist, the 5th gear ration different (gears) and the  54 speedo gear (plastic) different for all axle rations vast.

all this photos are on the 5sp page,  in fixkick.com for 10 years.

[fixkick]

I know all this because had to buy 3 boxes to make one, and had to check each part for fit and ratios and if overheated, as many are, and when overheated the gears are butter soft;
I spent 99% of my time, inspecting and measuring, with micrometers, (have many kinds here,inside and out)
the only tricks in this box (assembly)
where part 13 ball
the magic gap.
and that silly bolt 54 bit 52 on 2wd.