great input, i just made changes to the gallery here. BBC codes added. (direct links to photos) here is the 1st.....
the rotor not aligning (how far off never stated)
then the gear is wrong. see that here, and make sure the index aligns with the gear. how knows what PO did, (never try to get in their heads.)
PO : ran with belt off 1 notch, ran with all timing off.? who knows , all I know is what is,,,, and yours is wrong.
if you can not hit 5degrees (left on scale) BTDC, , in the whole range of the dizzy base slot then the gear is wrong.
the other possible is the , the crank shaft pulley rubber guts has slipped. (seen too) fooling the mech that timing is off when in fact not.
the pulley is only used during ignition timing. so....
if found out that with the TDC finder tool.
at TDC #1 , how far is rotor off, when dizzy base slot set min an max?
ACID TEST on cam gear and dizzy rotor alignment is here.
![[Image: 3_30_04_13_2_13_49.jpeg]](http://www.fixkick.com/bbs2/Suzuki-bbs/gallery/3_30_04_13_2_13_49.jpeg)
see warning here.
the rubber bond can shear here.
![[Image: tdc-look2.jpg]](http://www.fixkick.com/IGN_timing/tdc-look2.jpg)
one easy way to rule out the pulley (crank) slip.
add the #1 firing paint to the top cam wheel. with paint. 180deg from E rim mark per above.
then
put the cam top cog wheel at this new mark, to the 12pm back pan mark 12pm. #1 firing.
now look at the crank pulley see the 0 , v notch mark it must be very near 0 ,if not the crank pulley is toast. (stripped)
way 2 is using a real TDC tool, (or a 14mm bolts stop device)
or a drinking straw down the spark hole and daftly check, TDC for highest point (not too accurate )
i dont know how far off the rotor is,,, but if the added marks on the cam cog shows
1: the rotor aligns,using added cam cog marks, then the cam is good. if not its wrong. ( this is really easy to do with cam covers off)
2: if you are using the crank pulley marks to drop the dizzy then all bets off. (FSM way) the pulley must not be sheared,
the FSM assumes 2 things.
1: the crank pulley did not shear. (they do)
2: the cam gear is indexed at rear of cam.
if either are wrong, its a shop stopper.
in the case of #1 , remark the pulley and pray, it dont slip more.
in the case of #2 , hopeless. (due to rotor misalignment)
comment 2
on any motor, any with rubber guts , harmonic dampener, type Crank pulleys,
when i remove any of them in hand , I mark the inside TDC mark then, using a ruler is see of the outer rim mark is still at the correct location. I use a Tri-Square tool to do that.
it finds the center of the pulley so i can project out the TDC marks to the other rim , in about 1min flat.
but rotor misalignment (not looking at crank pulley) is a cam issue
see the TDC marks added to the cam cog ,below.
here, i just added it to the gallery.
i can assure you, assumptions are the killer of all good mechanics. do not assume, measure, and discover the real truth,
and do not discount 2 wrongs, some times, make a right. correcting 1 wrong, uncovers the next.
![[Image: 3_30_04_13_3_29_42.jpeg]](http://www.fixkick.com/bbs2/Suzuki-bbs/gallery/3_30_04_13_3_29_42.jpeg)
warning 2
some cogs are marked on both sides, suzuki , in that case uses 1 cog for 3 engines.
the I marks are for 3cyl.
but if you have a DOHC motor, they run the cogs above and then flip the cog 2 , front to back on the second cam.
if you see marks on both sides, watch out. not saying this one has that. just that this is very common in Suz world. (they cut a fat hog there)
is your I key mark on the left?
for sure ive never seen every permutation of every suzuki cog, but I do know to look real careful.
Conclusion.
Do the TDC #1 acid cam cog timing test, if that passes and rotor aligns, then all is ok, cam to dizzy
if the above is good
then the pulley mark is wrong. (never trust the mark) always validate it.
they are original, there are darn few other parts , made that are not.
the only question is, not indexed right or the crank pulley slipped.
damage or PO errors.
the PO may have found this error and timing it some other way to make him happy.. like using non stock, belt timing...
the acid test on the cam, per above proves this.
if the acid test passes, the crank pulley is bad.
just one test. and bingo.
the rotor not aligning (how far off never stated)
then the gear is wrong. see that here, and make sure the index aligns with the gear. how knows what PO did, (never try to get in their heads.)
PO : ran with belt off 1 notch, ran with all timing off.? who knows , all I know is what is,,,, and yours is wrong.
if you can not hit 5degrees (left on scale) BTDC, , in the whole range of the dizzy base slot then the gear is wrong.
the other possible is the , the crank shaft pulley rubber guts has slipped. (seen too) fooling the mech that timing is off when in fact not.
the pulley is only used during ignition timing. so....
if found out that with the TDC finder tool.
at TDC #1 , how far is rotor off, when dizzy base slot set min an max?
ACID TEST on cam gear and dizzy rotor alignment is here.
see warning here.
the rubber bond can shear here.
one easy way to rule out the pulley (crank) slip.
add the #1 firing paint to the top cam wheel. with paint. 180deg from E rim mark per above.
then
put the cam top cog wheel at this new mark, to the 12pm back pan mark 12pm. #1 firing.
now look at the crank pulley see the 0 , v notch mark it must be very near 0 ,if not the crank pulley is toast. (stripped)
way 2 is using a real TDC tool, (or a 14mm bolts stop device)
or a drinking straw down the spark hole and daftly check, TDC for highest point (not too accurate )
i dont know how far off the rotor is,,, but if the added marks on the cam cog shows
1: the rotor aligns,using added cam cog marks, then the cam is good. if not its wrong. ( this is really easy to do with cam covers off)
2: if you are using the crank pulley marks to drop the dizzy then all bets off. (FSM way) the pulley must not be sheared,
the FSM assumes 2 things.
1: the crank pulley did not shear. (they do)
2: the cam gear is indexed at rear of cam.
if either are wrong, its a shop stopper.
in the case of #1 , remark the pulley and pray, it dont slip more.
in the case of #2 , hopeless. (due to rotor misalignment)
comment 2
on any motor, any with rubber guts , harmonic dampener, type Crank pulleys,
when i remove any of them in hand , I mark the inside TDC mark then, using a ruler is see of the outer rim mark is still at the correct location. I use a Tri-Square tool to do that.
it finds the center of the pulley so i can project out the TDC marks to the other rim , in about 1min flat.
but rotor misalignment (not looking at crank pulley) is a cam issue
see the TDC marks added to the cam cog ,below.
here, i just added it to the gallery.
i can assure you, assumptions are the killer of all good mechanics. do not assume, measure, and discover the real truth,
and do not discount 2 wrongs, some times, make a right. correcting 1 wrong, uncovers the next.
warning 2
some cogs are marked on both sides, suzuki , in that case uses 1 cog for 3 engines.
the I marks are for 3cyl.
but if you have a DOHC motor, they run the cogs above and then flip the cog 2 , front to back on the second cam.
if you see marks on both sides, watch out. not saying this one has that. just that this is very common in Suz world. (they cut a fat hog there)
is your I key mark on the left?
for sure ive never seen every permutation of every suzuki cog, but I do know to look real careful.
Conclusion.
Do the TDC #1 acid cam cog timing test, if that passes and rotor aligns, then all is ok, cam to dizzy
if the above is good
then the pulley mark is wrong. (never trust the mark) always validate it.
they are original, there are darn few other parts , made that are not.
the only question is, not indexed right or the crank pulley slipped.
damage or PO errors.
the PO may have found this error and timing it some other way to make him happy.. like using non stock, belt timing...
the acid test on the cam, per above proves this.
if the acid test passes, the crank pulley is bad.
just one test. and bingo.
http://www.fixkick.com