03-14-2020, 07:58 AM
(This post was last modified: 03-14-2020, 11:19 AM by 3Waggintails.)
Once again, I will do my best to answer your questions:
1. I posted picture of my tps on the answer to the temperature sensor throttle body post but will post here.
2. When car loses power it does catch up with a little more throttle/foot pressure. I never have to floor it to make it recover. Just a little more pressure.
3. They claimed to have checked fuel pressure, timing, vacum. Cant speak for compression.
4. Engine only bogs hot but not consistenetly. You can drive til reaches operating temp a few miles - say 3-5 miles. The the bog starts. After 3-5 more miles it stops and I can drive 15 with no more issues. Havent had had chnace to drive further. Also, after the bogging, if engine cools 15-20 minutes and you drive again, once guage at operating doesnt do again. The only consistent symptom is the "hiccup" at idle when you stop at a light, stop sign, etc. Idles smooth then a little hiccup, smooth hiccup...you can see it if you stand in front of motor.
5. The engine appeared to be idling at 800 or so after they had initially corrected my throttle body mess up by
fooling with the black plastic screw on top of the throttle body. But would often drop to 500 if you continued sitting idling.
6. Yes on full power at at 45 mph. Has full power after short hsitation and the gradually inclining roads around here. I have never had to floor it or go all out....just gradual little pressure on gas pedal and goes fine.
They cleaned all ports etc when took off intake manifold. new gaskets etc. It was expensive! The biggest part of the $1025 bill.
Just got info back on research. The part number on my big fat TPS is TS60 -6 and underneath that 5301
I did purchase a throttle body off ebay that was from a 98 Tracker, 16 v, MT, 2wd - same as me except 2dr and I am 4 dr. It had the smaller TPS seen on left and was same as one from Advance. Advance shows what looks like mine CONFIRMED and sent to me by Mikuni a few minutes ago. So it appears I may have had a 95 throttle body which is insane. Bone stock car I got at 60k mikes from estate of older couple. I dont think it was ever swapped by anyone.
Mechanic shop is swapping the throttle body and correct TPS as we speak. Worth a shot? I am desperate. Discussed closed loop with them, etc. They will see. Said will check.
I checked parts pages did not see the TPS stuff!!! Sorry. You have direct link? I am really confused now at how this happen.
UPDATE:
Mechanic shop called while I was responding to your post and said they had swapped the throttle bodies and TPS's. Said car was running great, driven lots, going to drive more etc. About an hour later they called and said "IT'S DOING THE SAME THING!" bogging, etc. So they have left it up to me over the weekend to decide what I wnat them to do.
I am going to try and give you a better time line and series of events to what happened to maybe it will help us both further. First let me say, there was NOTHING wrong the car and the way it ran. NO ISSUES, no bogging no nothing. I was taking care of routine maintenance things that I could not previously afford (time and $$).
1. In April 2019 I had the following done: PCV valve replaced, new crank position sensor (it was in a pkg/ket I had bought with engine seals etc., timing belt replaced, can and crank seals replaced, water pump replaced, oil pressure switch replaced, new hoses, thermostat replaced (yes correct with rubber seal - YOU HELPED ME WITH THAT ONE!), new air filter and new belts.
2. I got new tires and wanted alignment. Was told steering eeer box needed replacement, front struts bad, front lower control arm bushings. ALL done. I also asked to check oil leak and it was distributor o rings. FIXED. Also had bad muffler (I did that one), I asked to scan car just see why CEL on (for almst 4 years). Came back with upstream O2 and PO400. So I decided to replace both O2 sensors and they checked the EGR and said EGR and Switch and Modulator good. They could not get upstream O2 sensor out so told me to take to exhaust shop. I figured po400 stayed on because of front O2 still not replaced.
3. Took to exhaust shop and they couldnt get the front O2 out so created a BUNG hole in the downpipe between the manifold and the cat and installed the upstream O2 there. Cleared codes. I drove 2-3 days, code popped again. But no driveability issues. Was fine.
4. So I decided to replace EGR, EGR switch and modulator - finish the job get rid of code! I also wanted the all the vacum lines replaces just BECAUSE they are 23 years old. That was not done. *****THIS IS WHEN THE hicccup began at idle and I happened to pay attention to the rpms at idle which was about 500. No driveability issue, hesitation or bogging...nothing but hiccup at idle. (this was 2/3/20)
5. On 2/10/20 is when I apparently got bad gas as that is first time experienced the bogging. I was 20 miles from home and it started on interstate. I got off and went to Advance to scan - only PO400. I put Heat additive in tank thinking my symptoms were bad gas. Drove 10 miles issue cleared up. On 2/11/20, I took to shop to have smoke tested due to PO400 still on and to have check fuel filter cuz suspected bad gas. Smoke good. Only place came out was air box - told me normal. The cleaned the MAF at that time at my request.
This is when tank drained and "wiped" clean, new fuel pump, screen/strainer, fuel filter and gas cap installed. I also decided to have them do plugs, wires, distributor cap and rotor as had not been done in my ownership - prbably ever.
Hiccup continued at idle only with idle at 500.
6.. I drove car approximately 1 week and suddenly, the bogging started again at 20-25 mph instead of the 65-70 mph on the interstae a week before. It cleared up as I stated. Little heavier pressure on gas pedal and goes! Drove it several times in order to figure out it did not happen cold or before being at operating temp for 3-5 miles or so. Also found out it pretty much went away after driving another 3-5 miles. Still idles at 500 when stopped at stop, light, etc.
7. My mechnaic slammed so found other shop that will work on older cars. took there 2/21/20. They kept for a week. The replaced IAT and ECT sensors, disassembled intake manifold and cleaned, replaced intake gaskets. DID NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Did exactly same - $1025 worth of labor and small $$$ of that for parts. Got car back on 2/28/20.
8. Took car back on 3/4/20 and they spposedly found two vacum lines swapped they did wrong, checked plug gap and gapped correctly (other shop no gap just slapped em in - i WATCHED! i THOUGHT THEY KNEW SOMETHING i DIDNT), CHECKED TIMING. Not sure if anything else. Next I know, they said maybe MAF. I waited for confirmation so I could order. Nope...said TPS. I asked if they checked it with meter or whatever and sure it was bad? I was told yes. Not case. Was told today they just thought symptoms of TPS so....
9. Today, 3/13/20 Because I had this throttle body and new TPS (which both should have been correct for this car) and we could not locate the correct TPS, decided to try swapping the throttle bodies/TPS to correct. NOPE!!! Ran good then started the bogging same as before. No better.
****So they called and left decision to me (too late, closing so be done Monday) - Leave new throtle body and TPS or put back way was? I think put back but pends your recommendation and what they gonna charge to put back way was, too. I AM SPENT!!!
How to proceed from here????
1. I posted picture of my tps on the answer to the temperature sensor throttle body post but will post here.
2. When car loses power it does catch up with a little more throttle/foot pressure. I never have to floor it to make it recover. Just a little more pressure.
3. They claimed to have checked fuel pressure, timing, vacum. Cant speak for compression.
4. Engine only bogs hot but not consistenetly. You can drive til reaches operating temp a few miles - say 3-5 miles. The the bog starts. After 3-5 more miles it stops and I can drive 15 with no more issues. Havent had had chnace to drive further. Also, after the bogging, if engine cools 15-20 minutes and you drive again, once guage at operating doesnt do again. The only consistent symptom is the "hiccup" at idle when you stop at a light, stop sign, etc. Idles smooth then a little hiccup, smooth hiccup...you can see it if you stand in front of motor.
5. The engine appeared to be idling at 800 or so after they had initially corrected my throttle body mess up by
fooling with the black plastic screw on top of the throttle body. But would often drop to 500 if you continued sitting idling.
6. Yes on full power at at 45 mph. Has full power after short hsitation and the gradually inclining roads around here. I have never had to floor it or go all out....just gradual little pressure on gas pedal and goes fine.
They cleaned all ports etc when took off intake manifold. new gaskets etc. It was expensive! The biggest part of the $1025 bill.
Just got info back on research. The part number on my big fat TPS is TS60 -6 and underneath that 5301
I did purchase a throttle body off ebay that was from a 98 Tracker, 16 v, MT, 2wd - same as me except 2dr and I am 4 dr. It had the smaller TPS seen on left and was same as one from Advance. Advance shows what looks like mine CONFIRMED and sent to me by Mikuni a few minutes ago. So it appears I may have had a 95 throttle body which is insane. Bone stock car I got at 60k mikes from estate of older couple. I dont think it was ever swapped by anyone.
Mechanic shop is swapping the throttle body and correct TPS as we speak. Worth a shot? I am desperate. Discussed closed loop with them, etc. They will see. Said will check.
I checked parts pages did not see the TPS stuff!!! Sorry. You have direct link? I am really confused now at how this happen.
UPDATE:
Mechanic shop called while I was responding to your post and said they had swapped the throttle bodies and TPS's. Said car was running great, driven lots, going to drive more etc. About an hour later they called and said "IT'S DOING THE SAME THING!" bogging, etc. So they have left it up to me over the weekend to decide what I wnat them to do.
I am going to try and give you a better time line and series of events to what happened to maybe it will help us both further. First let me say, there was NOTHING wrong the car and the way it ran. NO ISSUES, no bogging no nothing. I was taking care of routine maintenance things that I could not previously afford (time and $$).
1. In April 2019 I had the following done: PCV valve replaced, new crank position sensor (it was in a pkg/ket I had bought with engine seals etc., timing belt replaced, can and crank seals replaced, water pump replaced, oil pressure switch replaced, new hoses, thermostat replaced (yes correct with rubber seal - YOU HELPED ME WITH THAT ONE!), new air filter and new belts.
2. I got new tires and wanted alignment. Was told steering eeer box needed replacement, front struts bad, front lower control arm bushings. ALL done. I also asked to check oil leak and it was distributor o rings. FIXED. Also had bad muffler (I did that one), I asked to scan car just see why CEL on (for almst 4 years). Came back with upstream O2 and PO400. So I decided to replace both O2 sensors and they checked the EGR and said EGR and Switch and Modulator good. They could not get upstream O2 sensor out so told me to take to exhaust shop. I figured po400 stayed on because of front O2 still not replaced.
3. Took to exhaust shop and they couldnt get the front O2 out so created a BUNG hole in the downpipe between the manifold and the cat and installed the upstream O2 there. Cleared codes. I drove 2-3 days, code popped again. But no driveability issues. Was fine.
4. So I decided to replace EGR, EGR switch and modulator - finish the job get rid of code! I also wanted the all the vacum lines replaces just BECAUSE they are 23 years old. That was not done. *****THIS IS WHEN THE hicccup began at idle and I happened to pay attention to the rpms at idle which was about 500. No driveability issue, hesitation or bogging...nothing but hiccup at idle. (this was 2/3/20)
5. On 2/10/20 is when I apparently got bad gas as that is first time experienced the bogging. I was 20 miles from home and it started on interstate. I got off and went to Advance to scan - only PO400. I put Heat additive in tank thinking my symptoms were bad gas. Drove 10 miles issue cleared up. On 2/11/20, I took to shop to have smoke tested due to PO400 still on and to have check fuel filter cuz suspected bad gas. Smoke good. Only place came out was air box - told me normal. The cleaned the MAF at that time at my request.
This is when tank drained and "wiped" clean, new fuel pump, screen/strainer, fuel filter and gas cap installed. I also decided to have them do plugs, wires, distributor cap and rotor as had not been done in my ownership - prbably ever.
Hiccup continued at idle only with idle at 500.
6.. I drove car approximately 1 week and suddenly, the bogging started again at 20-25 mph instead of the 65-70 mph on the interstae a week before. It cleared up as I stated. Little heavier pressure on gas pedal and goes! Drove it several times in order to figure out it did not happen cold or before being at operating temp for 3-5 miles or so. Also found out it pretty much went away after driving another 3-5 miles. Still idles at 500 when stopped at stop, light, etc.
7. My mechnaic slammed so found other shop that will work on older cars. took there 2/21/20. They kept for a week. The replaced IAT and ECT sensors, disassembled intake manifold and cleaned, replaced intake gaskets. DID NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Did exactly same - $1025 worth of labor and small $$$ of that for parts. Got car back on 2/28/20.
8. Took car back on 3/4/20 and they spposedly found two vacum lines swapped they did wrong, checked plug gap and gapped correctly (other shop no gap just slapped em in - i WATCHED! i THOUGHT THEY KNEW SOMETHING i DIDNT), CHECKED TIMING. Not sure if anything else. Next I know, they said maybe MAF. I waited for confirmation so I could order. Nope...said TPS. I asked if they checked it with meter or whatever and sure it was bad? I was told yes. Not case. Was told today they just thought symptoms of TPS so....
9. Today, 3/13/20 Because I had this throttle body and new TPS (which both should have been correct for this car) and we could not locate the correct TPS, decided to try swapping the throttle bodies/TPS to correct. NOPE!!! Ran good then started the bogging same as before. No better.
****So they called and left decision to me (too late, closing so be done Monday) - Leave new throtle body and TPS or put back way was? I think put back but pends your recommendation and what they gonna charge to put back way was, too. I AM SPENT!!!
How to proceed from here????