hello Ivan and Cheers.!
try to under stand the G16 has like 6 class types. world wide. (usa just 1) and ive yet to see your engine. ours are MAF inducted. all. this year.
and all this year, here, the map is eGR map, only. EGR map, is for your OBD2 EGR test 1 and test 1 monitor only.
some MAFS are hidden on the side of the Throttle body, seen nere in 1999 UP.
add to this, modern car run 2 air meters, maf and map, the MAP runs at lower speeds, its better there....then the MAF kicks in,,, Sorry i diverged...
YOur system.(dual fuel)
they cut the fuel injectors. Petrol , so that is the change over mechanism.
i read the schematic, i see they :
run their own 02 sensor. so now both ECU's have an 02 to use , must be LPG sensor used, for Stoich 15.5:1 (vg,very good)
i see they run a full blown (nice) ecu fueling table. good
It would need dyno tuning to get that right. (or someone elses tables from there G16b) (we sell them here, in usa for turbos)
i see one error? on the makers schematic, the cut the P-ECU, MAP sensors (baro pressure) (bad idea that) but you have on MAF. so.../????
If you have TBI car this will kill the p-ECu dead, and limphome mode. so my guess, is your car it (PINK) connects to nothing. on that L-ECU wire.
Is your MAF connected and working at the air cleaner ,like when car ,was new. ?
Some CLASS G16b have MAF against air cleaner, others have it inside throttle body. and with iSC in body, some 2 wire, (mine) and other 6wire.yours
our ecu can see all data too. if obd1. per this factory page (consolidated by me) and all obd2 , full PID logging is super easy. PiD is live data.
http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/Tech1/tech1_output.html
the G16s , all egr, main vavles (vacuum operated) stick about every 50,000 miles. 90km? (cleaning them since 1980)
they do that, the 6 wire electric EGR runs far longer.
but is a factor of, if engine run for that long stuck in limphome mode ,; eg: super rich and super carbon build up.
a good runing engine the egr will last a long time before cleaning is needed. (tan exahust ports, are a clue that is happening)
the reason i ask questions about the old p=ECU, is that it runs all spark and all advance.
anything that upsets the old P-ECU will cause the advancing tables to go nuts.
that includes the MAF, (it is the pre-cursor to engine load, variables. and the index to all spark maps as is RPM)
so if the maf sees air leaks, bam, spark is retarded.(advance)
This has always been a problem doing PIGGYBACK (ecu;s) for Turbo charging any EFI car.
they end up fooling the base ECU, and the software in the base ecu or tables are upset.
the L-ECU can only work as good as the P-ECU's spark lets it...a serious limit if ever.
the old vitara. we get 28mpg (24city)easy. but the EGR closed at every traffic stop. if not we clean it , every time, rpm drops below 800 hot . EGR is cause, (all else good)
15mpg is 15.68 L/100km limphome is TOP REASON> all EFI in USA do limp mode. and a/t transmissions....
or if MPG is too High we scan it, there are many reasons why high listing a few top reasons
Limphome, mode, goes to 15mpg. and turns the CAT red hot, (if in fact it still alive, most are not) retarded spark, rpm cap, and super rich fueling. and worse 1995 and older)
FPR reg, bad,(most are this old, leaking diaphram or stuck closed)
high fuel pressure, 55psi ? oops
leaking injectors (or not balanced)
map bad (hose bad in all cases) or MAF bad, clean it , or buy MAF from Suzuki for $1200 (insane price)
02 sensor bad
02 not bad,but #4 exhaust port cracked (as all do,it seems) sucking in air, causing o2 to go to 0v, and ecu slams rich, ecu is LoST. (cant find stoich)
ECt reads way too low.(or thermostat bad)
8v, IAT READS too low.
best is to scan it and watch all sensors,and LTFT, if LTFT is not near -5% at idle, something is up.
I can help you get 28mpg for sure. or Result: 8.4 L/100km ! on the road, not 80mph , sane speeds for box kite, with high CG.
that is correct LPG keeps valves cool !
where does you L-ECU get RPM or CMP data? ?? i missed that?
FYI STUFF: (MY FAV. TOPIC)
i see Europe , tightening then smog net!
130g/km CO2 limits (fiat c500 does 84 now, Tier A)
and now checking NOX, correctly(measuring it and not trusting VW to tell truth, shock !)
so IN EU, countries, checking NOX what does that mean, it means they will also check, HC, CO too and find problems.
here in USA they blindly trust the 02 sensors, 1996 up. (NO ROLLER, NO TAIL SNIFFING) (DUMB, NO?)
that is why VW fooled us, too,
if i was in charge, they have:
tested every 1000TH car on a dyno load roller (like 1995 cars do) (Like TSA does for random body searches at air ports.)
(devils advocate(tongue firmly planted in cheek)
and then what
easy
2 random speed done (tech, tosses dice), foiling the VW liar ECU tricks
one other VW trick is to see front wheel not spinning with ABS sensors (and knows, (evil) omg gringo's are testing me......)
so turn them off ABS, during all smog tests. kill ABS, and FOIL vw. or all others.
I MENTION ALLthis , to call attention to, the possibility of future, stricter rules on all cars, for smog, testing rules
most cars here, we cant do what you did, because that violates factory smog controls.
we do have a program for converting gross polluters, to lpg, or cng.(a one way trip) but is not allowed to be DUAL fuel with Petrol.
things are moving fast, its like 1971 and 1988 all over again."EPA air quality controls" we were like fist in that...
I remember the President of FIAT a few years back (love him) saying he does not know how "1.6L tDI from VW passes usa smog.(smart man)"
they didnt! AS WE ALL NOW KNOW.
IMO VW (had 3 choices, sell 900cc TDI , (kill the 1.6 dead , huge investment in tooling and engineering) or not sell them here (the spec, is impossible here, if you read it)
or lie.
hard choices,all 3.
The usa spec on diesel is crazy low.... really IMO so low, diesels will end soon here I BET, and with CO2,. 2 knifes to the back. (co2, and NOX) double dead.
or 2: 1 shrink in DISPLACMENT. (non trivial that)
one nice thing, is that now for the first time, all makers of cars, are on a level playing field, if our stupid GOVernment learns hot test for smog properly
like we do in the semiconductor business
we take samples up stream (based on failure rates desired, there is no zero,in a real world) and we shut down production when it fails.
we disqualify the plant,. until its get low failure rates. (includes smog in the future, I bet !!!)
its not 1970 now.
on cars we'd test the engine in the assembly plant engine way before it was shipped the main body plant. (why hobble the main line)
see?
we call that the front end. (and 2 plants, so 1 is always certified,) in our case the bad lots are destroyed
in the case of engine, it's REworked.
and reinserted to final test. line.
this will be the future of engines.... The smog fighting gloves will now come off,or better the blinders.......
the tighter the smog spec, the worse this gets. at all levels..
cheers.
PS:
parting shot. (liar boxes, piggyback setups,and dual fuel piggy backs, yours.
all persons doing this this, discovered ?
that they can make it work good,or great,but in all cases the stock ECU randomly went nuts. (and if obd1 , worse)
all did. (top names like Greg Banish) see blue book....
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/s/greg+ban...tid=110184
he talks about all this, all the problems found fooling the stock ECU.
on ours the ROM is fixed, can not be changed. (in the CPU core)
the problem is the software is UNKNOWN, and has flaws,,,, in fact our 1996 is listed as EPA non compliant to OBD2 spec, (bad monitors) have proof.
the flaws are big week points. (like having painting the Mona Liesa. with a 2 year old jerking your arm)
one flaw in our pre 96s is the idle surge problem (dangerous iSC software)
the solution is simple, get rid of the stock ecu, end problem.
a custom ecu, installed and tuned.
or our G16 some ,regress the cam to the old 1990 mech,distributor so they dont have to tune spark(dyno time is very expensive)
sorry for long post
but ,this is my thoughts about future smog testing, (you aint seen nuttn yet)
Co2 is not the worst gas exiting the tail pipe. for green house gasses. wait till they get a full grip on that fact.... just wait.... early warning....
the piggy is what it is read this
http://www.enginebasics.com/EFI%20Tuning...alone.html
answer the first question, its yes. it is a piggy back, the stock ECU runs spark. (and is all software 99%)
the reason it will fail is simple
no human knows your ecu software algorithms. so how can a dumb L-ECU now this? ,it can't under all conditions.
to prove anomalies, out
log all live data from both ECu's
and monitor all input pins on the P-ECU. see if something flips wrong. at point of failures... all hard work.
or run the G16 cam and distrib. (ecu no longer controls spark this way)
and if savvy trim fly weights in the distrib to get advance best for LPG.
no software spark. zero.
try to under stand the G16 has like 6 class types. world wide. (usa just 1) and ive yet to see your engine. ours are MAF inducted. all. this year.
and all this year, here, the map is eGR map, only. EGR map, is for your OBD2 EGR test 1 and test 1 monitor only.
some MAFS are hidden on the side of the Throttle body, seen nere in 1999 UP.
add to this, modern car run 2 air meters, maf and map, the MAP runs at lower speeds, its better there....then the MAF kicks in,,, Sorry i diverged...
YOur system.(dual fuel)
they cut the fuel injectors. Petrol , so that is the change over mechanism.
i read the schematic, i see they :
run their own 02 sensor. so now both ECU's have an 02 to use , must be LPG sensor used, for Stoich 15.5:1 (vg,very good)
i see they run a full blown (nice) ecu fueling table. good
It would need dyno tuning to get that right. (or someone elses tables from there G16b) (we sell them here, in usa for turbos)
i see one error? on the makers schematic, the cut the P-ECU, MAP sensors (baro pressure) (bad idea that) but you have on MAF. so.../????
If you have TBI car this will kill the p-ECu dead, and limphome mode. so my guess, is your car it (PINK) connects to nothing. on that L-ECU wire.
Is your MAF connected and working at the air cleaner ,like when car ,was new. ?
Some CLASS G16b have MAF against air cleaner, others have it inside throttle body. and with iSC in body, some 2 wire, (mine) and other 6wire.yours
our ecu can see all data too. if obd1. per this factory page (consolidated by me) and all obd2 , full PID logging is super easy. PiD is live data.
http://www.fixkick.com/ECU/Tech1/tech1_output.html
the G16s , all egr, main vavles (vacuum operated) stick about every 50,000 miles. 90km? (cleaning them since 1980)
they do that, the 6 wire electric EGR runs far longer.
but is a factor of, if engine run for that long stuck in limphome mode ,; eg: super rich and super carbon build up.
a good runing engine the egr will last a long time before cleaning is needed. (tan exahust ports, are a clue that is happening)
the reason i ask questions about the old p=ECU, is that it runs all spark and all advance.
anything that upsets the old P-ECU will cause the advancing tables to go nuts.
that includes the MAF, (it is the pre-cursor to engine load, variables. and the index to all spark maps as is RPM)
so if the maf sees air leaks, bam, spark is retarded.(advance)
This has always been a problem doing PIGGYBACK (ecu;s) for Turbo charging any EFI car.
they end up fooling the base ECU, and the software in the base ecu or tables are upset.
the L-ECU can only work as good as the P-ECU's spark lets it...a serious limit if ever.
the old vitara. we get 28mpg (24city)easy. but the EGR closed at every traffic stop. if not we clean it , every time, rpm drops below 800 hot . EGR is cause, (all else good)
15mpg is 15.68 L/100km limphome is TOP REASON> all EFI in USA do limp mode. and a/t transmissions....
or if MPG is too High we scan it, there are many reasons why high listing a few top reasons
Limphome, mode, goes to 15mpg. and turns the CAT red hot, (if in fact it still alive, most are not) retarded spark, rpm cap, and super rich fueling. and worse 1995 and older)
FPR reg, bad,(most are this old, leaking diaphram or stuck closed)
high fuel pressure, 55psi ? oops
leaking injectors (or not balanced)
map bad (hose bad in all cases) or MAF bad, clean it , or buy MAF from Suzuki for $1200 (insane price)
02 sensor bad
02 not bad,but #4 exhaust port cracked (as all do,it seems) sucking in air, causing o2 to go to 0v, and ecu slams rich, ecu is LoST. (cant find stoich)
ECt reads way too low.(or thermostat bad)
8v, IAT READS too low.
best is to scan it and watch all sensors,and LTFT, if LTFT is not near -5% at idle, something is up.
I can help you get 28mpg for sure. or Result: 8.4 L/100km ! on the road, not 80mph , sane speeds for box kite, with high CG.
that is correct LPG keeps valves cool !
where does you L-ECU get RPM or CMP data? ?? i missed that?
FYI STUFF: (MY FAV. TOPIC)
i see Europe , tightening then smog net!
130g/km CO2 limits (fiat c500 does 84 now, Tier A)
and now checking NOX, correctly(measuring it and not trusting VW to tell truth, shock !)
so IN EU, countries, checking NOX what does that mean, it means they will also check, HC, CO too and find problems.
here in USA they blindly trust the 02 sensors, 1996 up. (NO ROLLER, NO TAIL SNIFFING) (DUMB, NO?)
that is why VW fooled us, too,
if i was in charge, they have:
tested every 1000TH car on a dyno load roller (like 1995 cars do) (Like TSA does for random body searches at air ports.)
(devils advocate(tongue firmly planted in cheek)
and then what
easy
2 random speed done (tech, tosses dice), foiling the VW liar ECU tricks
one other VW trick is to see front wheel not spinning with ABS sensors (and knows, (evil) omg gringo's are testing me......)
so turn them off ABS, during all smog tests. kill ABS, and FOIL vw. or all others.
I MENTION ALLthis , to call attention to, the possibility of future, stricter rules on all cars, for smog, testing rules
most cars here, we cant do what you did, because that violates factory smog controls.
we do have a program for converting gross polluters, to lpg, or cng.(a one way trip) but is not allowed to be DUAL fuel with Petrol.
things are moving fast, its like 1971 and 1988 all over again."EPA air quality controls" we were like fist in that...
I remember the President of FIAT a few years back (love him) saying he does not know how "1.6L tDI from VW passes usa smog.(smart man)"
they didnt! AS WE ALL NOW KNOW.
IMO VW (had 3 choices, sell 900cc TDI , (kill the 1.6 dead , huge investment in tooling and engineering) or not sell them here (the spec, is impossible here, if you read it)
or lie.
hard choices,all 3.
The usa spec on diesel is crazy low.... really IMO so low, diesels will end soon here I BET, and with CO2,. 2 knifes to the back. (co2, and NOX) double dead.
or 2: 1 shrink in DISPLACMENT. (non trivial that)
one nice thing, is that now for the first time, all makers of cars, are on a level playing field, if our stupid GOVernment learns hot test for smog properly
like we do in the semiconductor business
we take samples up stream (based on failure rates desired, there is no zero,in a real world) and we shut down production when it fails.
we disqualify the plant,. until its get low failure rates. (includes smog in the future, I bet !!!)
its not 1970 now.
on cars we'd test the engine in the assembly plant engine way before it was shipped the main body plant. (why hobble the main line)
see?
we call that the front end. (and 2 plants, so 1 is always certified,) in our case the bad lots are destroyed
in the case of engine, it's REworked.
and reinserted to final test. line.
this will be the future of engines.... The smog fighting gloves will now come off,or better the blinders.......
the tighter the smog spec, the worse this gets. at all levels..
cheers.
PS:
parting shot. (liar boxes, piggyback setups,and dual fuel piggy backs, yours.
all persons doing this this, discovered ?
that they can make it work good,or great,but in all cases the stock ECU randomly went nuts. (and if obd1 , worse)
all did. (top names like Greg Banish) see blue book....
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/s/greg+ban...tid=110184
he talks about all this, all the problems found fooling the stock ECU.
on ours the ROM is fixed, can not be changed. (in the CPU core)
the problem is the software is UNKNOWN, and has flaws,,,, in fact our 1996 is listed as EPA non compliant to OBD2 spec, (bad monitors) have proof.
the flaws are big week points. (like having painting the Mona Liesa. with a 2 year old jerking your arm)
one flaw in our pre 96s is the idle surge problem (dangerous iSC software)
the solution is simple, get rid of the stock ecu, end problem.
a custom ecu, installed and tuned.
or our G16 some ,regress the cam to the old 1990 mech,distributor so they dont have to tune spark(dyno time is very expensive)
sorry for long post
but ,this is my thoughts about future smog testing, (you aint seen nuttn yet)
Co2 is not the worst gas exiting the tail pipe. for green house gasses. wait till they get a full grip on that fact.... just wait.... early warning....
the piggy is what it is read this
http://www.enginebasics.com/EFI%20Tuning...alone.html
answer the first question, its yes. it is a piggy back, the stock ECU runs spark. (and is all software 99%)
the reason it will fail is simple
no human knows your ecu software algorithms. so how can a dumb L-ECU now this? ,it can't under all conditions.
to prove anomalies, out
log all live data from both ECu's
and monitor all input pins on the P-ECU. see if something flips wrong. at point of failures... all hard work.
or run the G16 cam and distrib. (ecu no longer controls spark this way)
and if savvy trim fly weights in the distrib to get advance best for LPG.
no software spark. zero.
http://www.fixkick.com