The Usual Post About Running Issues

[theunnamed1]

Hello Fixkick,

Great site you have here. I'll be around a lot more as I just traded my Samurai for a Sidekick. Mechanically savvy, but new to vehicle electronics.

I've been driving this 95 Sidekick JX 4 door 1.6 16 valve California Emissions for 2 weeks without a problem. Drives like a dream. Previous owner (reputable member of the Suzuki community) also had no issues with it.

First day I had it it threw an EGR code for and hour and then went away so I didn't worry about it.

The issue now is this: Took it to exhaust shop to get new exhaust. It's been welded and re welded 50 times over. It's been running without a catalytic converter for I don't know how long, so I was going to get one installed.

The mechanic started the car the next day and got the engine warm to melt snow off the vehicle. When he came back outside the snow was melted but the vehicle was off. Now it wont start back up. It cranks and fires but there isn't even enough to to give it the gas pedal to see if it will stay running before it dies.

I personally think the EGR valve is clogged based on what I have read here and the fact it has been without a converter for so long. I may have wrote off the EGR code earlier, but maybe there actually was an issue?

Let me know what you think. A bit upset as I just wanted the exhaust to be done today, but now I gotta go and diagnose this thing in this guys lot after work instead.

Thanks.

[fixkick]

Hello Fixkick,

Great site you have here. I'll be around a lot more as I just traded my Samurai for a Sidekick. Mechanically savvy, but new to vehicle electronics.

I've been driving this 95 Sidekick JX 4 door 1.6 16 valve California Emissions for 2 weeks without a problem. Drives like a dream. Previous owner (reputable member of the Suzuki community) also had no issues with it.

First day I had it it threw an EGR code for and hour and then went away so I didn't worry about it.
this is a thermal sensor inside the EGR main, called EGRT.but if need be we can fool it with a jumper resistor 10k ohms , ask.

The issue now is this: Took it to exhaust shop to get new exhaust. It's been welded and re welded 50 times over. It's been running without a catalytic converter for I don't know how long, so I was going to get one installed.
DID YOU>? EGR flow rates will not work with no cat. so... fixing EGR with no cat is a wasted effort.

The mechanic started the car the next day and got the engine warm to melt snow off the vehicle.
When he came back outside the snow was melted but the vehicle was off.
Now it wont start back up.
It cranks and fires but there isn't even enough to to give it the gas pedal to see if it will stay running before it dies.
so sparks ok, are the spark tips black or white. if black then its rich and fouling spark plugs
if white, then you lost fuel pressures, or MAP died, or air leaks to the induction behind the MAF


I personally think the EGR valve is clogged based on what I have read here and the fact it has been without a converter for so long. I may have wrote off the EGR code 51 earlier, but maybe there actually was an issue?
This is not it. The egr only your is dead, 2 ways, packed in carbon, long ago and CAT kills the rest missing.
Then engine can run fine with no CAT or EGR, but best is to fool the EGRT, ask. so the ecu does not go to limphome. (cal cars might)

Let me know what you think. A bit upset as I just wanted the exhaust to be done today, but now I gotta go and diagnose this thing in this guys lot after work instead.
sorry for you loss and pain, no fun stranded or working in field lacking a shop full of tools.

Thanks.

if it were mine like this
spark plug out. black,? put in a new set gapped at .028" and drive home
if it will not run at all, try test fuel, to see if the engines ok, i must run on test fuel. (spray)
may sure it flashes code 12, with the diag jumper in place, cranking for 5 seconds.
it must, 51s sure ignore. it will run on 51 fails.
thats it
good luck.
and happy holidays!

pS: keep in mind the EGR is not active at idle., and not at wide open throttle,
it only needs to clos s 100% at idle, (check it by hand, flex its diaphram) if not engine will run like near 400rpm then stall. shaking like mad.

[theunnamed1]

[/quote]
The issue now is this: Took it to exhaust shop to get new exhaust. It's been welded and re welded 50 times over. It's been running without a catalytic converter for I don't know how long, so I was going to get one installed.
DID YOU>? EGR flow rates will not work with no cat. so... fixing EGR with no cat is a wasted effort.


if it were mine like this
spark plug out. black,? put in a new set gapped at .028" and drive home
if it will not run at all, try test fuel, to see if the engines ok, i must run on test fuel. (spray)
may sure it flashes code 12, with the diag jumper in place, cranking for 5 seconds.
it must, 51s sure ignore. it will run on 51 fails.
thats it
good luck.
and happy holidays!

pS: keep in mind the EGR is not active at idle., and not at wide open throttle,
it only needs to clos s 100% at idle, (check it by hand, flex its diaphram) if not engine will run like near 400rpm then stall. shaking like mad.
[/quote]

I drove it to the exhaust shop just fine. The brand new converter is sitting in the passenger seat for him to install but he cant get it started now. Spark plugs are only 5 days old. They are the proper ones that Suzuki calls for.

EGR is not the issue then. At least not whats causing a no start/stall situation. Likely we are looking at spark or fuel. I put fuel in the tank before I dropped it off, but maybe when he let it idle to clear snow he ran it out of gas? I hope he is smart enough to check for that before he calls me and says it wont start. Anyways, I will bring some starter fluid with me to check for fuel issue. Like I said, plugs are new so I don't think that is the issue unless the spark is having problems farther down the line.

Your'e saying before I try and start it on test fuel I should check for code 12 when cranking. That means I am ok as long as it repeats.

[fixkick]

The issue now is this: Took it to exhaust shop to get new exhaust. It's been welded and re welded 50 times over. It's been running without a catalytic converter for I don't know how long, so I was going to get one installed.
DID YOU>? EGR flow rates will not work with no cat. so... fixing EGR with no cat is a wasted effort.


if it were mine like this
spark plug out. black,? put in a new set gapped at .028" and drive home
if it will not run at all, try test fuel, to see if the engines ok, i must run on test fuel. (spray)
may sure it flashes code 12, with the diag jumper in place, cranking for 5 seconds.
it must, 51s sure ignore. it will run on 51 fails.
thats it
good luck.
and happy holidays!

pS: keep in mind the EGR is not active at idle., and not at wide open throttle,
it only needs to clos s 100% at idle, (check it by hand, flex its diaphram) if not engine will run like near 400rpm then stall. shaking like mad.
[/quote]

I drove it to the exhaust shop just fine. The brand new converter is sitting in the passenger seat for him to install but he cant get it started now. Spark plugs are only 5 days old. They are the proper ones that Suzuki calls for.

EGR is not the issue then. At least not whats causing a no start/stall situation. Likely we are looking at spark or fuel. I put fuel in the tank before I dropped it off, but maybe when he let it idle to clear snow he ran it out of gas? I hope he is smart enough to check for that before he calls me and says it wont start. Anyways, I will bring some starter fluid with me to check for fuel issue. Like I said, plugs are new so I don't think that is the issue unless the spark is having problems farther down the line.

Your'e saying before I try and start it on test fuel I should check for code 12 when cranking. That means I am ok as long as it repeats.
[/quote]


im mention plugs only for 2 reasons
1: gaped wrong. as many do , thinking they come pre-gapped, (hopeless at .045" as come from factory spark plug making machine.)
2: and the 89-95 years love to turn them black, in LIMPHOME. ( just pulling one plug and we go, oops.... limphome, or worse)

if rich fouling black think limphome, or fuel pressure too high (FPR jammed shut is common this old) or injector leaks.
if lean, mAF dead? or weak or needs cleaning.
if no fuel, fuel pump died, if the diagnostic jumper ,gets you 12s. flashing.

this car and all like it cut fuel if the ECU sees no spark, no spark to this ECU is TACHO line dead. only that. and bam no injections now.
code 41 code 42, is that

[theunnamed1]

I think what you have said will give me a good starting point for Diag.

I did gap my plugs at .030 as I did not have a .028.

1. Test if it will run on test fuel. If yes, then it's fuel system. If not, ignition.
2. Test plug color. If black then probably in limphome or too high fuel pressure. If white then dead MAF.
3. If good fuel and good plug color, look for code 41 or 42 which means bad tach wire and no spark so ECU shuts off fuel.

[fixkick]

I think what you have said will give me a good starting point for Diag.

I did gap my plugs at .030 as I did not have a .028. 30 THOU SHOULD BE OK.

1. Test if it will run on test fuel. If yes, then it's fuel system. If not, ignition.
2. Test plug color. If black then probably in limphome or too high fuel pressure. If white then dead MAF. (weak only, dead goes to limphome rich as pig)
the cam belt can slip at any time, spark timing found way off...
3. If good fuel and good plug color, look for code 41 or 42 which means bad tach wire and no spark so ECU shuts off fuel.

first see if iit is flooding?
crank wide open throttle cuts all fuel to clear foods.
cheers!

[theunnamed1]

Heres what happened. I showed up after car had been sitting for about 3 hours. And when I tried to start it.... It started right up.

1-2 minites later it died. It would not start again. This makes me think it has something to do with the engine being warm. I bet if I wait a few hours from now it would start back up again. I did not have a chance to check the condition of the plugs, but I think they would be ok if the engine runs perfect for 2 minutes.

Battery is charging. I did have a chance to check that. I also didnt have any faults.I am confused even more now.

[theunnamed1]

I think what you have said will give me a good starting point for Diag.

I did gap my plugs at .030 as I did not have a .028. 30 THOU SHOULD BE OK.

1. Test if it will run on test fuel. If yes, then it's fuel system. If not, ignition.
2. Test plug color. If black then probably in limphome or too high fuel pressure. If white then dead MAF. (weak only, dead goes to limphome rich as pig)
the cam belt can slip at any time, spark timing found way off...
3. If good fuel and good plug color, look for code 41 or 42 which means bad tach wire and no spark so ECU shuts off fuel.

first see if iit is flooding?
crank wide open throttle cuts all fuel to clear foods.
cheers!

I will check for flooding tonight.

Also, I was wondering if maybe I had water in the tank. Ice now since its 5* F

And fuel filter is old so I am going to replace that because it probably needs it anyways.