cruise throttle surge - Printable Version +- Car Repair Forum (https://fixkick.com/forum) +-- Forum: Suzuki (https://fixkick.com/forum/forum-suzuki) +--- Forum: Sidekick/Tracker (https://fixkick.com/forum/forum-sidekick-tracker) +--- Thread: cruise throttle surge (/thread-cruise-throttle-surge) |
RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-11-2019 can I defeat the EGR, ? sure you can , in fact i bet it already is. most are now, very dead. 99%? if the quad ports in the intake are not packed solid in carbon as most are. then all you need is vacuum path to work and CAT present. top fails for EGR , list (those folks that get smog test know all about these) 1: CAT MISSING 2: CAT BROKE UP (THE ELEMENT INSIDE CRACKED ONE DAY THEN BROKE UP TO DUST AND BLEW OUT THE END OF TAIL PIPE) 3: The Exhaust manifold port 4 port clogged in carbon, 4: the head tunnel port same (packed) 5: the intake S tunnel same, packed. (intake manifold) 6: the 4 quad ports EGR injectors 1 or more packed. in the intake manifold. 7: the vacuum magic above fails. 8: hoses leak or missing or TRANSPOSED wrong. 9: VSV valve broken , plastic nipples there easy to snap off, doing service near by, or the 2 wires to it cut. RE: cruise throttle surge - 1995 toad - 11-12-2019 (11-11-2019, 11:04 PM)fixkick Wrote:its not 14(11-11-2019, 11:49 AM)1995 toad Wrote:so line 14 steel tube rusted and leaks ? what ever leaks needs only to be replaced. (use vacuum hand pump tool to find leaks is best)(11-11-2019, 11:38 AM)fixkick Wrote:the vacuum that leaking is coming from the metal line that leads to the intake. when the egr valve is closed the vacuum leaks out of the valve. the exhaust port side is sealed from the intake side of the port.(11-11-2019, 08:40 AM)1995 toad Wrote:(11-11-2019, 08:23 AM)fixkick Wrote: but the port from the intake doesn't seal off the vacuum? the line that sends the exhaust to the intake manifold from the egr does not seal at the egr when the egr is closed and sending no exhaust to the intake. it should seal I would think. RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-12-2019 there is no line that sends exhaust to the intake, (pipe 50)_ that is why I posted the drawing to find out where you are working touching and looking, IDK, that. The EGR path for Exhaust is: 1: exh port #4 , bored path in exhaust manifold. (no lines no hoses here) 2: then to the head drilling path (no lines no hoses) 3: then to the S path borings and welsh plugs in intake rear sections, no lines here, no hose. 4; then the EGR is closed or not, allowing this bored path to let exhaust to to all 4 EGR injectors, if car is late 1995 it has a SSD metal PIPE 50 that sends exh, up to the TB mono port drilling behind the TB, for mono port EGR injections. that is how the EGR path works (not vac) lets do pipe 50 , on late year 1995 G16B EGR class 2. cars, seen like in Calif. first by CALIF CARB rules. and all 96 and newer have this 96/98 NOTE PIPE 50,,, seen here I cover the mono port (pipe 50 is #1 clue) here. Pipe 50 is the only external lines that run exhaust on any sidekick, mostly on 1996 up. older are quad port 92-95 USA. This pipe is steel stainless steel and shins no rust. the line (which one) that sends the exhaust to the intake manifold (where is this) from the egr (4 ports on it which one) does not seal at the egr when the egr is closed and sending no exhaust to the intake. it should seal I would think. (yes all parts do seal but NOT THE MOD) please tell or show the part or end of part that is not sealing IDK , i do not know where speak of. RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-13-2019 the bark tube (my name ) makes barking sounds or PUTT PUTT sounds if you run engine if it is removed. this is what makes the modulator above . this is hose. rubber, EPDM. pipe 50 is present is a steel SST line. the bark hose is on the #4 exhaust side not the Intake vacuum sides, but if the valve main is open it is both. obviously. The PUTTS are strong, and the MOD regulates EGR exhaust flows. It looks like this. flow is vertical axis. load on engine is horz, load is MOD valve measured, and THE CAT must present or load is zero full time. I cant see your engine whats there or missing so I must guess what EGR grade you have, (engine with pipe 50 or not) pipe 50 is vastly more easy to service. (x10 that in smog states tested) RE: cruise throttle surge - 1995 toad - 11-13-2019 (11-12-2019, 11:51 PM)fixkick Wrote: there is no line that sends exhaust to the intake, (pipe 50)_ that is why I posted the drawing to find out where you are working touching and looking, IDK, that. that is what I am talking about. that seems like that should seal when the valve is closed or there is a vacuum leak and idle problems when warm.. put another new valve in tonight. seemed sealed when egr closed... we will see what happens... does the probe signal the ecm that the egr is bad? What makes the code get sent for the egr.. RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-13-2019 that is what I am talking about. (what ?) are you telling me you have PIPE ID#50 or not?) please tell me this? and part 36. (if yes it is the full blown CALIF car version code E33) that seems like that (what does that mean? (name the part ID please) should seal when the valve (MAIN5?) is closed or there is a vacuum leak and idle problems when warm.. put another new valve in tonight. (which valve there are 3 VALVES at least. ,main, MOD and vsv) seemed sealed when egr closed... (please tell exact part there are many) we will see what happens... does the probe signal the ecm that the egr is bad? (the probe is the CALIF EGR thermister sensor, and if the ECU sees the EGR fail to warm the sensor BAM CODE 51) What makes the code get sent for the egr.. (easy the ECU scans it any time it activates the EGR over 0mph, and if the EGRT probe is missing or dead, or fails to shot HOT, CODE 51. Great question and the 96+ uses EGR MAP sensor and does 2 tests not one to test EGR (harder to pass too) That the EGR SYstem evolved, by generations and by CALIF laws that latter were adopted by FED LAw, EPA. My ECU pages show those, and when they happened. The first car 1992 (16v) has no pipe 50, nor has EGRT thermo sensor ID #36 (engine swaps happen and I can not see your engine and what is there in full) the CALIF laws, added 36 and then adopted USA wide, (see function matrix here) [/url] there are 2 kinds of Customers here, one that can't pass SMOG IM240 tests. (in calif or any state , many that make you do thata) then there are other folks with EGR parts leaking or parts stuck open,. causes vacuum leaks on any 16valve G16 invites lean mix and performance issues. (bad gasket 6) or both, reasons. (smog test and engine problems) The EGR that sticks open can stall and engine. (most time EGR main is BAD for that) the EGR main can stick or leak at the EGR MAIN valve, this is very common and the engine wants to stall. EGR MUST BE disabled (ecu logic does that) at idle if not every stop light you stall. (so common this) vast and valid problems are associated with the EGR. gasket 6 missing or cracked or not the high temperature rated fails fast and sucks air (vacuum leaks) to test THE EGR for (non smog test failure reasons ,just testing for drive ability issues) is easy. kinda.... 1 : make sure gasket 6 is not missing or a wrecked and sucking AIR. (good and valid gaskets work best , the look silver'ish, the silver is heat proof !!! 2: make sure the EGR main #5 is not body cracked, yes they can crack. and suck air and makes the MAF reading now wrong,. for sure at idle. and never good. 3: then with engine dead cold (no burn fingers) push the EGR 5 test ring inward and release, make sure the valve goes thunk each time and seals or it is hopeless to use this valve it MUST CLOSE and stay closed at idle. ONce 100% sure the MAIN5 is closed, pull the vacuum line 23 and GOLF TEE IT, (or use screw that seals the end of 23) now EGR IS DEAD but CLOSED! 4: drive the car if you have problems with misfire , bogs, or hesitations in power at the the throttle , that means you have other problems not associated with EGR. for smog testing , code 51 is that. to make EGR actually work start here on my Gen2 page. (how to make code 51 go away as smog states mandate) [url=https://www.fixkick.com/EGR.html]see the first line that shows stall test. IF THE ENGINE FAILS WITH EGR defeated, there are vast things that cause cruising SURGE.
RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-13-2019 at your 1st post , it would have been better showing photos of engine, so we can see what you have. ( stock, not stock, missing parts and wrong parts are 10x more easy for me to see) and answers vary by all that. top view best, so I can see all parts on the engine. DO YOU HAVE PART 50 and 36? many of these cars must have 36 but last owner lost it some how or installed and illegal year 92 , EGR main on the engine. super common to see, and no chances to pass smog in CALIF. also one why to learn if the CAR uses #36 is to tell the ECU part number, that tells me if it has 36. (the older cars used vacuum tests to test , EGR functions) see ecu 1-7 here.? (the ECU dictates what EGR parts must be present on your engine) RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-13-2019 in the USA here are the smog test states, https://www.mytime.com/guide/Smog-Check/Articles/find-out-your-states-smog-check-requirements-with-this-quick-and-easy-reference-guide that rule 5-25 year old cars, is very wise. new cars are clean, all are, unless wrecked offroad damage, under body, CAT ,, etc. and over 25years old the parts are not sold to fix smog this old, vast cars this old, many parts can not be bought. (yugo, suzuki, ISUZU,SAAB, and lots more SATURN? , volvo, , lots more the wiki has and endless list...) Cars go defunct, and suzuki has vast parts listed as Discontinued now.... and only 2 online stores, west and east coast. Some cars missing parts are picked up by 3rd party seller but some states do not allow, non true certified, smog parts (calif CARB or EPA) in there state. even exhaust CAT FORWARD not allowed. Lucky if you look on rockauto.com most of the parts related are there. EGR main and sensor and little else on topic. no legal exhaust manifold for 16v, that is EGR device #4 port. NO MOD VALVE , NO VSV. and prices, OMG huge, like 2 times what they were a few years back. (fiat currency!) if you get smog checked this is first. as always and where, matters! BIG TIME. RE: cruise throttle surge - fixkick - 11-13-2019 code 51 btw is 99% carbon impacted paths, blockage, for sure that nasty quad port engine , part 50 missing , is the hard nut to crack (fix) even the sensor alone can pack in cake of carbon. easy. RE: cruise throttle surge - 1995 toad - 11-14-2019 (11-13-2019, 10:22 PM)fixkick Wrote: that is what I am talking about. (what ?) are you telling me you have PIPE ID#50 or not?) please tell me this? and part 36. (if yes it is the full blown CALIF car version code E33) that's what im talking about is line 50 vacuum coming from it valve im talking about is the egr not sealing vacuum coming from 50. the surge or miss went away with the first new egr after about 75 miles the cel came on with 51 code and idle would go to about 300 or 400 then recover after about 30 seconds or so to 800 other than that it ran great. none of the idle problems show till warm pulled the new egr and found vacuum from line 50 leaking through the egr valve while at idle and exhaust side closed. installed new egr and haven't driven it yet. the only non stock thing is a gutted cat do to a slide off the road landing on cat with curb. it had been gutted for about 2 years prior to all these issues. At idle I have a fairly good vacuum (haven't put a gauge on it but holds a finger tight when covered) also at idle I have fairly good Exhaust pressure ( again no pressure gauge). Don't need to pass smog How do I test the egrt probe? is it a on or off switch or at different temps, different resistances if the egr doesn't seal the vacuum off that comes from hose 50 what filters that air. ie like the vacuum coming to valve that's turned on by the exhaust pressure to activate the egr. thanks much I appreciate your time |