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+--- Thread: Gear Lube Stabilizer (/thread-gear-lube-stabilizer)
Gear Lube Stabilizer - sina27 - 07-27-2019
Hello,
Got a 96 Tracker 2WD 5 speed.
Currently running Penzoil Synchromesh in my transmission. The transmission and clutch were recently rebuilt. Clutch cable is new, and so are the plastic seals under the shifter.
I feel balking and difficulty shifting every now and then, especially in 2nd, when downshifting.
i was wondering if anyone has tried adding oil stabilizer in their gear lube? Would it be safe to use? I'm thinking about using the Lucas oil stabilizer, there are two of them:
Lucas Transmission Fix, it says for smaller transmissions to use 12oz
https://lucasoil.com/products/problem-solvers-utility/lucas-transmission-fix
There is also the regular Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer, which says it can also be used in manual transmissions, says to add 25% to light manual transmissions:
https://lucasoil.com/products/engine-oil-additives/heavy-duty-oil-stabilizer
Think its worth trying out ?
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - fixkick - 07-27-2019
(07-27-2019, 03:27 AM)sina27 Wrote: Hello,can't do snake oil me .
Got a 96 Tracker 2WD 5 speed.
Currently running Penzoil Synchromesh in my transmission. The transmission and clutch were recently rebuilt. Clutch cable is new, and so are the plastic seals under the shifter.
I feel balking and difficulty shifting every now and then, especially in 2nd, when downshifting.
i was wondering if anyone has tried adding oil stabilizer in their gear lube? Would it be safe to use? I'm thinking about using the Lucas oil stabilizer, there are two of them:
Lucas Transmission Fix, it says for smaller transmissions to use 12oz
https://lucasoil.com/products/problem-solvers-utility/lucas-transmission-fix
There is also the regular Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer, which says it can also be used in manual transmissions, says to add 25% to light manual transmissions:
https://lucasoil.com/products/engine-oil-additives/heavy-duty-oil-stabilizer
Think its worth trying out ?
but balks when?
only 3 to 2, (guessing this)
2 to 1.
and never grinds into reverse?
if only one gear balks (miles on car are what, 100k 300k>?)
then that synchro ring is worn out and 3 to 2 down shift failure is #2 synchro, warn out.
anything that makes the lube more slipper, will make it worse, for sure real SYN LUBE.
the inner ring has groves when those are gone and looks smooth the ring is now end of life, all you can do is learn to double clutch it, like we did with crash box days.
or go to GL5 and the thicker oil may work better. and old box will be sensitive to GL brands.
also the speed you are driving and if faster, when downshifting, will put more demand the that 2nd gear ring, do the huge gear speed differences.,
the ring is a speed matching device that lets 2nd gear dogs, dog in and not balk, (gears dont really move, only the dog locks do, and this is a constant mesh box.
but the ring is it, it must grab the ring clutch cone or it will BALK ever time unless going slower.
how that helps, good luck to you!
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - sina27 - 07-27-2019
(07-27-2019, 04:24 AM)thanks. So synchromesh lube is slippy and you said try out GL5? I thought GL5 was a no no for these trannys. Is there any particular brand of gear lube you recommend I try out, that is GL5? Wrote:(07-27-2019, 03:27 AM)sina27 Wrote: Hello,can't do snake oil me .
Got a 96 Tracker 2WD 5 speed.
Currently running Penzoil Synchromesh in my transmission. The transmission and clutch were recently rebuilt. Clutch cable is new, and so are the plastic seals under the shifter.
I feel balking and difficulty shifting every now and then, especially in 2nd, when downshifting.
i was wondering if anyone has tried adding oil stabilizer in their gear lube? Would it be safe to use? I'm thinking about using the Lucas oil stabilizer, there are two of them:
Lucas Transmission Fix, it says for smaller transmissions to use 12oz
https://lucasoil.com/products/problem-solvers-utility/lucas-transmission-fix
There is also the regular Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer, which says it can also be used in manual transmissions, says to add 25% to light manual transmissions:
https://lucasoil.com/products/engine-oil-additives/heavy-duty-oil-stabilizer
Think its worth trying out ?
but balks when?
only 3 to 2, (guessing this)
2 to 1.
and never grinds into reverse?
if only one gear balks (miles on car are what, 100k 300k>?)
then that synchro ring is worn out and 3 to 2 down shift failure is #2 synchro, warn out.
anything that makes the lube more slipper, will make it worse, for sure real SYN LUBE.
the inner ring has groves when those are gone and looks smooth the ring is now end of life, all you can do is learn to double clutch it, like we did with crash box days.
or go to GL5 and the thicker oil may work better. and old box will be sensitive to GL brands.
also the speed you are driving and if faster, when downshifting, will put more demand the that 2nd gear ring, do the huge gear speed differences.,
the ring is a speed matching device that lets 2nd gear dogs, dog in and not balk, (gears dont really move, only the dog locks do, and this is a constant mesh box.
but the ring is it, it must grab the ring clutch cone or it will BALK ever time unless going slower.
how that helps, good luck to you!
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - sina27 - 07-27-2019
Okay- I'll avoid using the transmission additive.
Instead - I think I'll try another oil; The back of the Penzoil Synehcromesh says its GL3 rated. Shouldnt it be Gl4 rated, since the manual states Gl4 is required?
My local NAPA has Sta Lube Gear Oil GL4 85W-90; I want to go with this - however could the weight rating be problematic? The manual calls for 75W-90, and that seems pretty far off from the 75W-90 that is required. Would it make a difference?
I live in California, so the temperature is usually warm here, in case that makes a difference.
Thanks
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - fixkick - 07-27-2019
keep in mind the manual was printed 2 decades ago....
you only have 2 choices, new synchros.
or try different lube. (some GL5 is safe for yellow metal , not all but some (yellow/brass) The old lubes GL5 has EP rating and to do that the additive in GL5 eats yellow metal, but some today do not. but only reading full spec lube can answer that or ask maker)
the bearings in the box will be happy with any GL lube, that is for sure. the car does not pull 5000lb loads, like a 1 ton Chevy truck can.
the only thing you want to think about are the synchro rings, the inside of said ring
see this see those groves, those bite in to polished cones. (on the base sliding dogs)
if the oil is too slipper or too tin on a worn right then it slips or becomes super slow to match RPM speeds,(its job is that)
see? a box this old can have those grooves now thin (or worse ring cracked) and then if worn likes only some GL4 lube , 85w sounds better. no?
![[Image: outer1.JPG]](https://fixkick.com/tranny/outer1.JPG)
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - fixkick - 07-27-2019
those teeth are the dog teeth that completes the shift.
the the synchro matches speeds just before dog teeth lockup. the teeth dog in to part 37, (hope my photos show whats up, once seen live one never forgets what's going on here)
that what they do, and the do not last 300,000 miles in the city or so.
the cone blocker , is part 19
https://fixkick.com/tranny/5thGear.JPG
the whole counter shaft is here (actual) me rebuilding it with new bearings and all new brass rings. when done ran like brand new car.
https://fixkick.com/tranny/images/prob2.jpg
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - sina27 - 08-15-2019
(07-27-2019, 10:49 PM)fixkick Wrote: those teeth are the dog teeth that completes the shift.
the the synchro matches speeds just before dog teeth lockup. the teeth dog in to part 37, (hope my photos show whats up, once seen live one never forgets what's going on here)
that what they do, and the do not last 300,000 miles in the city or so.
the cone blocker , is part 19
https://fixkick.com/tranny/5thGear.JPG
the whole counter shaft is here (actual) me rebuilding it with new bearings and all new brass rings. when done ran like brand new car.
https://fixkick.com/tranny/images/prob2.jpg
SO -
I tried out the Sta-Lube 85W-90. The shifting has improved, but it only shifts well when the car is fully warmed up. Going into 2nd gear seems fine. Downshifting however, still gives some resistance. When I first start up the car and its cold, shifting into 1st and 2nd is very difficult. Its take a couple miles of driving for shifting to improve. I assume that the oil is too high in weight and too viscous when cold. Keep in mind that right now, its very hot in california - so I'm wondering once winter comes around, shifting will get even harder.
Since I was previously using Synchromesh (75W-90), and that was too "slippery", and now the Sta-Lube 85W-90 is most likely too viscous, maybe I should aim towards something that is 80W-90?
Do you have any recommendations on a good oil for my climate? Something with a viscosity in between syncrhomesh and the sta-lube? I'm not too worried about availability of these oils since I'm willing to buy them online
Thanks!
RE: Gear Lube Stabilizer - fixkick - 08-15-2019
finding a lube that likes an old box is not easy.
thick
thin
and syn?
are the 3 choices, which works best in an old worn box, is trial and error, short of new syncrho' rings'
the box heats to 180f , from the engine mating,,, or near.
so it may shift great hot.
if reverse grinds the clutch is dragging, this is the canary gear , early warning, of that.
balky shifts are synrhos slow to do the speed change (RPM) to shift the sycrho must match speeds then the dogs jump in super easy.
maybe some one run it low and lube, and the yellow metal there wore faster.
those silly top real rubber RAIL shift plugs wrecked many box, by leaking out lube;.
good luck to you!!!