(12-18-2017, 10:44 PM)fixkick Wrote: ok i have a poor neglected kick that has 200k miles.
i doubt the timing belt has ever been replaced and i bought it with 160k 15 years ago. been a great winter rig and i parked it july 2016.
when i got back from a long trip of 3 months the darn thing wouldnt start and i get no spark.
i can be an idiot at times and i might have disabled it thinking i would be smart but i doubt i did it as the common ways i would have done that which is pull a fuse or relay but everything is there.
When I go on long trips, I full fuses, FI or IG-Coil and or pull the distributor rotor. to stop thieves. (99% effective) or pull the suppressor device.


anyway i have given it a fresh tuneup with new plugs wires cap and rotor.
and going through the no spark troubleshooting (so you tested for spark at the coil and the 4 spark wires,?)
if the 4 are dead but the coil has spark that is clear sign the cam belt slipped, so now sparks between the cap terminals uselessly and dead.
i have no spark from coil. I have attempted to pull codes but i get no cel flash's 12 or other wise. i do have an o2 sensor that has caused the cel stay lit and like i said i have neglected this thing for a long time and now its time to put in the work. I removed the ecu and checked for leaking caps and i didnt see any. i havent ohm'd the coil yet.


i figured i would start replacing the cheapest things while waiting on the timing belt and related parts.

so things replaced is spark plugs wires cap rotor and went ahead and got a new igniter. (if coil wire spark is ok so be ignitor,)
next things i am thinking is coil or the crank angle position sensor.

i know the belt hasn't jumped or broke as the rotor position is spot correct for tdc. (good sign that, and true but rotor runs 2:1 ratio. from crank) and a timing light does work on a dead engine if sparks ok but wont start, timing light work even at 300rpm starter speeds)

yes this is true but right now i am getting zero spark so timing light wont help me on this.
so before i bought the parts for this thing i want to make sure i have spark before tearing into it any more.

so my question is. inside the distributor is what apears to be j811 crank position sensor. (the CMP is in side the distributor and never fails)

but the docs state that for 16v motors it should be under the engine at the oil pan. (wrong book, 1996 is first year of OBD2 CKP sensors)
rock auto doesnt list j811 and only has what appears to be at the crank. there is no crank sensor on any 1995 , if you see one there, that means someone put in a 1996 there but did not connect it because 1, no wires there and 2, the ECU has no CKP pin there ever.
not only that the 1996 starts and runs with the ckp dead, (kills misfire detection dead but runs) but 1995 cars have no missfire detecting ecu at all.
what i am wondering is the sensor within the distributor. you have a video showing how to test it off the vehicle using the led tester. i have no problem pulling the dizzy to test it. im just at a loss as you said this should only be for 8v and im wondering what the j811 sensor is if its for 8v and i know i have the 16v.


so what is the sensor within the distributor as the image what i see on the ckp section shows 8v only.

why not let the ECU tell you why the spark is bad, if spark is bad at the COIL terminal that is. (the coil has 1 larger wire we cannect that to a spark plug and do the 100 year old spark test, with a test spark plug and wire, and plug shell grounded.

ECU test, for now spark;

1 FI , and IG coil fuses not blown (both must be good) and Dome fuse if storing DTCs in memory is nice, and is. so 3 fuses above left knee...
if the cover was lost type fuse in my search box, fixkick.com
i have verified the fuses are good and have replaced them. have also verified the dome light works.
2: key on CEL must glow or ECU is dead, (or lamp missing or stolen) the CEL must glow first. does it? this must work ! on 95s, on a 96 our scan tool can read all CEL status , states.
CEL = SES. = check engine lamp, or service engine soon or MIL.
cel glows but doesnt flash even with jumper on the dlc block. can i jumper it in a different location?
3: then insert the diagnostic jumper see on the DLC.
the 95 year had 2 styles of DLC. 4 pin or 6,. most 16v have 6 pins as seen here, insert the jumper now, its harmless.
an unbent paper clip. (metal not plastic or painted clips, only metal works) (electrics)
http://www.fixkick.com/CEL/DLC/DiagJump.html
i have the 4 pins and have verified i have jumpered the correct pins.
this works running or not running.
4: key on, CEL glows, and now flashes 12s, , 12 = im ok. , 41/42 is spark failure per the page on DTC errors.
i get no flashes. 12 or other
5: crank for 5 full seconds, release key, this lets the ECU see that spark is bad. and will tell you why it is bad,
one DTC tells you CMP is dead , the other tells you the spark primary is dead (coil or ignitor dead or the spark suppressor fell off car harness)

all the above is for spark dead at the actual fire wall spark coil ,, ignition spark coil.

the ECU on this car generates all spark
fuses first.
CMP next.
ECU next.
ignitor then
coil , on fire wall, in 1996 the coil was moved to the inside of the distributor. your car is fire wall coil.

here is 96 wiring , dead accurate

http://www.fixkick.com/IGN_timing/no-spark.html#G16B-all

trick 1, crank engine and tachometer will move just a bit off 0. 200-300 rpm is about 1/3 up from to the 1k mark (1)
scope shows.
http://www.fixkick.com/IGN_timing/CAS-91.jpg

trick 2, using an analog needed meter set to 20vdc range , black grounded , red on white wire above (is the connector loose or corroded?)
the meter will wag (0v the 5vdc) as you crank this is a good CMP doing that.
so i called it the ckp but i was meaning the cas. and now that i looked again i am taking it as the j811 was used in both 8v and 16v and i need to check the blue wire for 12v and checking the black to white should show 5 volt as i am cranking. if this is correct i will run this test when i get home.
this CMP is a hall sensor and needs 12vdc to work or it will dead due to lack of power to run it. the blue=black wire is power.

the suppressor missing may cause weak spark but for sure kills dead all fuel injectors !
with this cause a no spark? i have tried starting it with ether after replacing the wires cap and rotor before testing the coil with known good new wires.

i am sorry I have no CMP photos of 16v engines.
its deep deep inside, its best just to leave it alone, or risk damaging it.
make sure the connector is good, at the DISTRIB.
and make sure the grounds near there are good.
the best way to test the CMP is with a scope , or meter, on the white wire, and let the ECU tell you its bad.
DTC error 42, (CEL blink codes) means CMP is dead.

the ecu knows its dead for 2 reasons, the crank signal is at 12vdc cranked, and cmp signal is dead. give it 5 full seconded cranked to let it learn that.
and tell you it is dead.

tell me is coil spark dead? this is first and test #1 on any car made, no start , wet or dry spark plugs.

yes no spark at coil. i will ohm it to verify primary and secondary are good