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+--- Thread: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question (/thread-sidekick-4speed-automatic-03-72le-venting-atf-capacity-question)
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RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - fixkick - 05-03-2015
sure.
the engine can run hot and that heat goes to he transmission, from metal path (bellhousing) and the rad A/T cooler, heats the transmission up to what ever
the engine thermostat is doing (180f, 190,192,195F whatever the last person bought and installed)
what is engine temps at stated tranny temp>?
180f is stock.sized.
the transmission can add to that value. if loaded with 1000lbs extra load, and flogging it up a hill , (not with locked up TCC,it will make heat , inside)
over filled the transmission will whip the ATF , up, and is never good.
your transmission was even used on Mazda mini vans. so is a pretty strong box.
i think the tranny temps are max 270f. beyond that is breaks down (Dexron VI spec)
the transmission clutch that slip makes heat, and then the more load you have the more slip you get, up hills. slip = heat.
This is why they have 8 and 9 speed transmissions now, to end (vastly reduce) that slip and (less heat , nets more mpg) (ever drive a 2 speed FORD, you'd know how bad this is, ouch)
and in any A/T box where the TC slips?, that makes,heat. lots of heat and the fluid expands, and if overfilled . it will leak as it expands.
if you run the engine at 180f.
and it holds there.?
and you're not slipping the heck out of the box. (clutch)?
the trans will be a tad less than 180f. via the hot water heated ATF fluid. it has no other choice, it's heated to that. temp (close) (Not in Alaska, or the like)
so most trans run about 200 -225 max, loaded. (or add an external cooler)
The TCM is tuned to shift a hot transmission. (on new cars, they measure this temp directly and shift it by the temperature factors and speed and engine measured loads)
and all this depends on ambient temp, as in Alaska? , it will be slow to warm up. but not in Keywest.
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - jgiralde - 05-04-2015
I bought a 1997 Tracker 3 weeks ago and the transtission leaked after I serviced it. I had the engine out so I drained the torque converter, replaced the front seal, pan gasket and filter. After getting the engine back in and back on the road the trany leaks. Puzzeling ? I got back under to see where it was leaking from, I found a electrical plug on left side just above the pan was the leak. You can't see it, the cat converter blocks your view but I could feel it. It slips in from the top, seals with an o-ring and has a electric connection on the bottom. You must remove the pan. I had to drop my trany mount and lower it (becarefull not to lower it to much, my distributor was aganist the firewall). I got the part from a local transmission rebuild shop.
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - fixkick - 05-04-2015
thanks for that.
this happens a lot now, with old the seals all shrink,or get hard and leak.
suzuki does sells the seal but takes forever to get it.
it's great to have a local source of parts. and a willing seller.
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - allan y - 05-05-2015
So pressure washed all underneath and I took the same drive again today I think the issue is resolved. There are no visible leaks. Looks like my final conclusion is that the issue was caused initial by being over serviced when I purchased the vehicle. It seams that about 3.5qt is what ended up being correct amount of ATF for my trany when doing a filter change, drain, and fill.
Thanks for all the responses....
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - fixkick - 05-09-2015
normal is engine temp ,180f, via the radiator transmission cooler/.heater at bottom of RAD
and up to 250F, Under huge stress. (up hill pulling a trailer of bricks/) The upper limit is the limit of Dexron VI.
the clutch TC makes a ton of heat when you are not in TCC lockup and it slips.
that slip makes heat in the AFT.
and will get hot. It wont be below 180F ever. as the engine does heat up the trans, 2 ways. (3 counting HP inputs)
think of the TC as heater generator and this becomes clear.
if the TC heat exceeds the engine radiators ability to cool it , the trans, temp will rise.
the engine is only 95HP. so you are limited in the ability to make too much heat there at the transmission input shaft.
trans heat will about 200F. par value.
if it rises too much look at engine heat, is it ok?
if its ok then the transmission is making too much heat or the trans cooler is dead.
with a good RAD, (not blocked inside or outside) the car can pull 1000 lbs without overloading the system and for sure never 10,000 lbs.
192 is nothing, very normal.
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - allan y - 05-09-2015
(05-09-2015, 01:39 AM)fixkick Wrote: normal is engine temp ,180f, via the radiator transmission cooler/.heater at bottom of RADThanks for the great information.
and up to 250F, Under huge stress. (up hill pulling a trailer of bricks/) The upper limit is the limit of Dexron VI.
the clutch TC makes a ton of heat when you are not in TCC lockup and it slips.
that slip makes heat in the AFT.
and will get hot. It wont be below 180F ever. as the engine does heat up the trans, 2 ways. (3 counting HP inputs)
think of the TC as heater generator and this becomes clear.
if the TC heat exceeds the engine radiators ability to cool it , the trans, temp will rise.
the engine is only 95HP. so you are limited in the ability to make too much heat there at the transmission input shaft.
trans heat will about 200F. par value.
if it rises too much look at engine heat, is it ok?
if its ok then the transmission is making too much heat or the trans cooler is dead.
with a good RAD, (not blocked inside or outside) the car can pull 1000 lbs without overloading the system and for sure never 10,000 lbs.
192 is nothing, very normal.
My engine temp was normal on my hill pull. I did not notice any real change on it. Pulling the hill the TC was not locked up so I would agree that was probably were most of my heat was coming from. I was thinking I might install a temporary heat prob from my multi-meter on the trany pan and drive for a bit to get a better indication on my rang to determine if I will add another cooler but at this point I am not to concerned about it. With the right fluid level everything has been working good.
RE: Sidekick 4speed Automatic 03-72LE // Venting ATF // Capacity Question - fixkick - 05-09-2015
it's all normal. (all most all that heat comes from the TC, and if full of foam, it will get hot) are you pulling brick loaded trailers?
the car can't pull a 5 lb trailer., much less 10k. (its not designed to do that) ever.
this transmission will not overheat. if the engine stays at 180F.
my 2 door car weights just 2000 lbs. one of the lightest cars made (it's like a box kite with high CG, ever drive in buffeting winds?, ouch , not fun....)
this 4 speed is used on much bigger cars, even the mazda mini van. ( up to 2 times our 2door weight and more loaded)
the Aisin Seiki A40D series is run in many a Toyota. it's not rare , the only unique part is the 4wd tail shaft adapter, for Suzuki. (and custom TCM)
the transmission is tuned to run at near 180F. (engine temps... ) if fact if runs too cold it shifts wrong. (harsh)
it's engine heated, and Rad cooled. (it may run 170f with no load , on flat roads at say 60mph, id not go faster in any kite)
here is a truck with a dash board, with trans gauge it's clear where the overheat marks are, and 190 is cold.
below that its not even warm yet, (this is new cars with syn AFT, that you too can run)
see the dash here?
http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/topic/130589-transmission-temperature/?p=1159544
http://www.transmasterstransmissions.com/transmission.html
I'd say 250F max. and if you hit 250 back off the throttle and find out cause.
Is engine too hot.?
Gauge fibbing?
too much or too little ATF (overfilling any transmission will cause it to foam up, and it may over heating or worse, imagine just the TC full of foam.?
and how bad that will slip and make heat. and starve bearings , air does not lubricate bearings, at all. it is like running , w40 for oil, thin and useless.
never over fill any A/T.
the correct amount is 1.6qt, and add to hot full. all other numbers are for overhaul....(or TC clutch out, or valve body out. etc.)
These cars tran's don't overheat, it's not really truck at all. it's a toy car. 2000 lbs. or 2000 + 1000 load.
We never see complaints of this ever, sure engines, but not trans. The trans will overheat with engine, they are married..
IF the a/t cooler lines in the RAD flow good, all is good., for this tiny light car.
Dexron VI fluid. This is a full synthetic fluid that can take MUCH more heat than a conventional fluid. (like DEXIII day 1)
so there are like 3 or more temperatures for the A/T. where is yours.?
1; pan AFT gauge>?
2: out bound trans line to rad. (super hot)
3: return line temp. this line goes to the pan, (cool side)
4: clutch temp ? youll never do that one, but the outbound line, is close to , and will be the most hot.
no dought heat kills most things.
but 180 is normal and 195 is only 15 degrees rise. (on a typcial hot day ) (not in Alaska on a very cold day , up there they have a bypass to the cooler, if too cold)