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+--- Thread: Dies when i give it gas (/thread-dies-when-i-give-it-gas)
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RE: Dies when i give it gas - bairan - 05-10-2019
ok, fuel pump test...1. keyon 42psi(only leak down to 35psi after 4 mins)
2. idle 33-35 psi. only thing i did notice was when i gave it gas the pressure would go up to about 42 psi then back down to 33psi at idle
i did put a leaf blower on the MAF and got it to put out about 3.8v. i also put a calibrator on the MAF input wire going back to the ECU and started out at 2v at idle. as i increased the voltage the idle started getting rough(as i assume the ECU was receiving that signal and adjusting the EFI). i had to give it gas to keep it running as i increase the voltage to the input. it would still try to bog down until i got above 4.8v then it seem to run better. i know that i could not vary the signal like i would be if it was coming from an MAF. so maybe MAF is no good. just odd that i had to get it to almost 5v before it would run right. does the MAF vary from 2v at idle to 5v at wot? i would have thought with a leaf blower i could have gotten the MAF to max out at 5v. so maybe it bad.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-11-2019
(05-10-2019, 11:06 PM)bairan Wrote: ok, fuel pump test...1. keyon 42psi(only leak down to 35psi after 4 mins)
2. idle 33-35 psi. only thing i did notice was when i gave it gas the pressure would go up to about 42 psi then back down to 33psi at idle
i did put a leaf blower on the MAF and got it to put out about 3.8v. i also put a calibrator on the MAF input wire going back to the ECU and started out at 2v at idle. as i increased the voltage the idle started getting rough(as i assume the ECU was receiving that signal and adjusting the EFI). i had to give it gas to keep it running as i increase the voltage to the input. it would still try to bog down until i got above 4.8v then it seem to run better. i know that i could not vary the signal like i would be if it was coming from an MAF. so maybe MAF is no good. just odd that i had to get it to almost 5v before it would run right. does the MAF vary from 2v at idle to 5v at wot? i would have thought with a leaf blower i could have gotten the MAF to max out at 5v. so maybe it bad.
wow a new forum , nicer.
ok the engine lacks power, unless in limphome mode, nice progress, there ok.?
1: not fuel pressure bad. nor FPR. bad
2: the maf is for sure good.
3: the maf tests also show that the maf must be way too high for your power, so the injectors are clogged did you ever have bad fuel in it or park it for years?>
5v or near is like hooking the maf to a 2.0 to 2.5liter engine, know that your maf is not just limited to 1.6Liters. displacement (suck factors)
no, the maf only does 1.6Liters of suck, (flow) how much is that? well 4vdc. max flow 55gm./min.
http://www.fixkick.com/sensors/92-95MAF/EXCEL-ECHO1.jpg
I built this chart map from driving my car, 1996. using wonderful OBD2 scans.
I now say this.
clogged injectors<<<< seems we are here, but what is the history on this car? try Chevron injector cleaner (bottle poured in the tank (its benzine strong)
compression low( i cant feel your power in limphome if is very powerful engine in LIMP then I'd say its ok)
is vacuum ok at idle 19iinchs HG. (cat clogged it will not be.) but if powerful engine in limp , no bad cat possible. clogged.
last is spark IDK , if spark is good , i cant hear or feel the engine, to know this but bad spark is violent and timing way off is huge power loss. all the time.
this maF IS THE HOT WIRE MAF RIGHT? (NO CONE SLIDING SILLY AIR FLOW AFM AS SEEN IN EUROPE)
YOUR ONE TEST THERE WITH YOU VERY WISE CHOICE MAKING YOUR OWN MAF , DC VOLTAGE INPUT SIMULATOR TELLS ALL WE NEED.
I Too have done that , in school it is taught. this.
it also cancels LIMPHOME doing that (UNTIL near 5vdc the shows DTC maf stuck too high, and now is REAL ECU injections normal.
you proved you must use illegal MAF voltage to get power.
injectors are clogged. up. seems to me.....
send them to witchhunter.com, you get them back with before and after flow readings, and cleaned.
https://www.witchhunter.com/
btw good luck to you!!!
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-11-2019
on that input of the ECU maf pin to ECU
do not exceed 4.75vdc, ok? most pins are protected but no need to take risks, and this pin is 1000 ohm ,exactly to ground it converts current to voltage for the ECU ADC>
also make sure the vref pin on the ecu is 4.75v to 5.25vdc, I think you did but I forgot ,sorry if yes.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - bairan - 05-15-2019
(05-11-2019, 07:58 AM)fixkick Wrote: on that input of the ECU maf pin to ECUok thanks, i will run some more cleaner thru it before i remove the injectors. So in limb mode the ECU does not use the injectors?
do not exceed 4.75vdc, ok? most pins are protected but no need to take risks, and this pin is 1000 ohm ,exactly to ground it converts current to voltage for the ECU ADC>
also make sure the vref pin on the ecu is 4.75v to 5.25vdc, I think you did but I forgot ,sorry if yes.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-15-2019
(05-15-2019, 12:12 AM)bairan Wrote:(05-11-2019, 07:58 AM)fixkick Wrote: on that input of the ECU maf pin to ECUok thanks, i will run some more cleaner thru it before i remove the injectors. So in limb mode the ECU does not use the injectors?
do not exceed 4.75vdc, ok? most pins are protected but no need to take risks, and this pin is 1000 ohm ,exactly to ground it converts current to voltage for the ECU ADC>
also make sure the vref pin on the ecu is 4.75v to 5.25vdc, I think you did but I forgot ,sorry if yes.
OK, first off , only the ECU connects to the 4 injectors. (i will list simple facts and few questions) there is no carburetor here.
I told you if the 4 injectors are 1/2way clogged (from bad fuel) the engine will bog, from lean, no power from engine much, that is lean , then you forced ECU to limphome
and that makes the ECU go super rich so super rich on lean injections give mover power, that is what happens on all MPI.
I guess you have car with no history, no knowing about bad gas or car found in a barn after 5 years, ?
the injects can not be hand cleaned but yes take with CHEVERON TECHRON bottle poured to tank can work or some.
the pro cleaning of injectors runs them backwards, why?
the unstasonic cleaning , must get the screens inside (10 micron sized) clean and ONLY back flowing them can clean them right.
the screens on hidden in the input side, ok? and are super FINE screens that keep stuff out of the injector side that can wreck them,
clogged screens are good, wrecked injector valves are a bad idea, so that that is why the screens are there,
and 4times smaller sized the screens than the best fuel filter at 40 microns.
if tank is full of rust ,that rust walks right past the filter and packs the screens.
now a story , about fungus.
one guy had a car.
he had 5 shops try to fix it and , and he asked me, Im just friend.
I first see no gas cap there, a rag for cap, LOL or some days no rag at all.
I drive the car and sure it bogs.
I then at the main fuel line , removed from RAIL and let it dump to a bucket, (a coffee can)
i key on like 10 times,. or crank (depends no car an years)
and the can fills with full say 1/2 way, with fuel.
I see red dust, in can bottom gee what is that, (took to a school and the BIOLOGY lab , mic, it and looked, OMG
guess what , water in fuel caused red fungus to fill the tank and clogged all the injectors 1/2 way.
hopeless, unless every inch cleaned.
so bad fuel or rust. or fungus, bad fuel is bad fuel no matter why.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-15-2019
one guy here (this forum), him in "Napal"
lean bog same. story
found fuel pressure low.
found previous owner, found FPR bad.
no FPR in town so.......
so he jammed, it up with bambo so it was same and no vacuum or near , the PO tuned the FPR with splinters until car ran batter, then sold it and the splinters, rotted away.
endless stories, on old cars, for sure hacked.
not saying your car is hacked , only saying expect anything and win.
this guy had some real funny photos of his FPR , a big big laugh.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-15-2019
the real thing about your engine/ecu
is that there are very few thing to cause lean like that, here is a list.
1: low fuel pressure wot (nop not yours)
2: FPR acts wrong (see my graph) , (nop yours works great.))
3: injectors clogged, sure.
4: ECT reads wrong, no if wrong it be not 300 ohms = 180f but higher ohms and richer fueling. (nah)
5: IAT BAD, NAH MOST 92 G16B, HAVE NON. (AIR TEMP SENSOR) DOES NEAR NOTHING IT S VERY FINE TRIM OR NONE.
6: O2 SENSORS STUCK RICH, NO THEY STICK LEAN THEY STICK AT 0-VOLTS (LEAN) AND THE ECU GOES MAX RICH ECU COUNTERS THE 02 LOGIC WISE. CALLED FUEL TRIM.
7: TPS BAD, NAH. IT ONLY CAUSES SHORT HESITATION. (if WOT After 2 second delay shows full power, now, then the TPS is not bad for sure if no TPS DTC errors.) AT WOT< THE MAF rules fuel injection rates.
8: WEAK MAF SURE. BUT NOT YOURS. (you did all test , and hard work to prove NO, in fact amazing works unlike anyone else did, and thanks so much for the blower data wow....
did i get them all... ?
RE: Dies when i give it gas - bairan - 05-15-2019
(05-15-2019, 04:14 AM)fixkick Wrote: the real thing about your engine/ecu
is that there are very few thing to cause lean like that, here is a list.
1: low fuel pressure wot (nop not yours)
2: FPR acts wrong , (nop))
3: injectors clogged, sure.
4: ECT reads wrong, no if wrong it be not 300 ohms = 180f but higher ohms and richer fueling. (nah)
5: IAT BAD, NAH MOST 92 G16B, HAVE NON. (AIR TEMP SENSOR) DOES NEAR NOTHING IT S VERY FINE TRIM OR NONE.
6: O2 SENSORS STUCK RICH, NO THEY STICK LEAN THEY STICK AT 0-VOLTS (LEAN) AND THE ECU GOES MAX RICH ECU COUNTERS THE 02 LOGIC WISE. CALLED FUEL TRIM.
7: TPS BAD, NAH. IT ONLY CAUSES SHORT HESITATION.
8: WEAK MAF SURE. BUT NOT YOURS. (you did all test , and hard work to prove NO, in fact amazing works unlike anyone else did, and thanks so much for the blower data wow....
did i get them all... ?
Thanks, for your info. if the cleaner dont fix, i will let you know if cleaning the injectors does the job.
RE: Dies when i give it gas - fixkick - 05-17-2019
I do hope you find the injectors clogged
not knowing history of car, nor if you ever seen it run perfectly before, limits my answer or causes me to go in wrong order.
if the car is 3 year+ parked barn car my answer would be different than,.
it was running for 3 year prefect but not today,.
then with clean injectors the car floods, after all old cars can have 3 to 10 problems some failure hide others,
or as you learned limphome mode hides clogged (1/2 way) injectors.
all we can do is fix each one , one by one, as we find them. (no scan tools here and no OBD2 to help) so is serial process. testing.